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hognoses
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by keyz on June 30, 2005
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can anyone please send me any reasuring info regardind their behaviour as i have recently met my first yearling hog nose biut am aware a bite is unsightly but not dangerous and i had found this particular snake which is male to be placid but told he did get "hissy" so anything to persuade my wife please thanks.
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RE: hognoses
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by Scootertrash on June 30, 2005
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I had hogs when I was a kid and some were nasty and some were pretty calm. the only real way they are sort of dangerous is if you are allergic to the very mild venom or if you for some odd reason let the animal chew on you for a while to get a lot of venom in. I saw some pics of a guy's hand after a bite but he let the snake gnaw on him for 5 minutes and the hand really swelled up. I guess what I'm saying is that a striking bite that is quick will probably do nothing. Maybe some others can add to this but i hope this helps (-:
Clayton
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RE: hognoses
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by Crotalus_Catcher on June 30, 2005
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I have worked with hogs for most of my short life. Easterns, westerns, and Mexican hognoses. They all tended to put one quite a show but I was NEVER bitten. And there were times when I tried to get one to bite. If you'll notice, all of his strikes will be with a closed mouth. I would not worry about an envenomation or even a bite with this species. Have fun with it, they're a good one to work with.
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I agree with Crotalus_Catcher...
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by MattHarris on June 30, 2005
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Their strikes are all closed-mouth bluffs. A friend here in NY is doing a tracking project, not to mention has relocated several being a wildlife rehabber, and not one has ever attempted to bite.
Even those pics that are floating around of the western hog bites, are highly suspect. If there's one snake that I would believe NEVER attempts to bite, it would be a hognose.
Matt
www.matabuey.com
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RE: I agree with Crotalus_Catcher...
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by Cro on June 30, 2005
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I hate to dissagree with you all on this topic, but there is always an exception to the `rule` when you are dealing with a wild animal. I have caught many, many Eastern and Southern Hognose, and a few Westerns. Almost all have made closed mouth strikes, if they struck at all. The exception to this was a nasty tempered 3.5 food melanistic Eastern Hognose that bit me very badly on my thumb. The wound must have been caused by one of the `toad Piercer` structures in the back of its throat, as it left a single deep puncture wound that bled a lot, started swelling immediately, and was very painfull. My hand was swolen and very painfull for several days. The best comparison would be the envenomation which would be caused by a small Copperhead bite.
This was a rare case. I would not hesitate to suggest that Hognose Snakes make great pets, and you really should not have many concerns about getting bitten by one. Best Regards JohnZ
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RE: hognoses
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by Scootertrash on July 1, 2005
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Two of my hogs that i had when i was a kid were just plain nasty. They would bite the hell out of me. The others were bluffers like John and Matt were saying. I never got bit real bad but i did get some nips. What's funny is the fact that I had no idea that they were even mildly venomous as I was a kid and had just started this hobby. What we learn with experience ehh?
Clayton
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Questions about which is the actual cause....
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by MattHarris on July 1, 2005
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...of the swelling. I think it is hard to dessiminate between the effects of the saliva/toxin, and what may be attributed to bacteria in their mouths. I've never found any definitive studies on this? Anyone else found any good material re: hog bites?
Matt
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RE: hognoses
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by Scootertrash on July 1, 2005
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You are quite right Matt. We haven't even entered the realm of bacteria causing swelling on this thread. They do have some horrendous bacteria in their mouths. I haven't seen any articles on this but would also be interested to see research papers etc. on both the bacteria and venom of hogs. As mentioned before, the pics of the man's swelled up hand could be from either bacteria or venom. I remember seeing one of the pics where the guy's hand and part of his arm were very swelled up. Would the bacteria make his arm swell up too or would it be local swelling around the bite. It's hard to diseminate whether venom did this or bacteria since the text said that he let the animal gnaw on him for a few minutes.
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RE: hognoses
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by BGF on July 1, 2005
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Its not going to be bacteria for the simple reason that bacteria don't act that fast. It is the toxins, pure and simple. We're doing quite a bit of work in the area and nailed down which of the toxin types is responsible for a good degree of the rapid swelling in a lot of the various colubrid bites ;-) We're preparing a number of articles to submit to disparate scientific journals.
Cheers
Bryan
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RE: hognoses
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by Cro on July 1, 2005
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Matt: The swelling after my Hognose bite started immediatly after the bite. Granted, it was an very unusual bite, as the Hognose engulfed my thumb very deeply into its mouth as it bit, almost a kind of freak accident kind of thing, but I have no doubt that the swelling was caused by envenomation and not bacteria infection. Like Bryan said, it was the acton of envenomation, not bacteria that caused such an rapid reaction. If bacteria acted that fast, there would be swollen, dead people all over the place! Best Regards JohnZ
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