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RE: de venomized
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by EPARR1 on September 6, 2007
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But to what extent ;)
Agreed
The debate is not that it aids digest althought that is how it is worded in our posts. It is whether or not venom is needed for digestion.
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RE: de venomized
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by FlaSnakeHunter on September 7, 2007
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First, let me state that I, too, am enjoying this discussion for two reasons:
1) Everyone is displaying courtesy and respect, and;
2) It is extremely interesting.
Actually, it appears to me that this discussion was particularly energized when earthguy stated "To add to what Charles has already said (and to clarify for you) venom aids in a snakes digestion. Removal of the venom apparatus greatly reduces the available diesting enzymes, which decreases digestion effectiveness, which can lead to the early demise of the animal. There will be those that argue that they have had a venomoid (the appropriate term for a snake with the venom glands removed) live " a long and happy life", but I assure you that is the excetion to the rule."
Particular emphasis should be placed upon "Removal of the venom apparatus greatly reduces the available diesting enzymes, which decreases digestion effectiveness, which can lead to the early demise of the animal."
These assertions are not based upon any research and, in the absence of legitimate research, we have to fall back on repetitive empirical observations which are quite contradictory to the above, especially the assertion regarding "early demise of the animal".
Empirically, this is not the case.
Great discussion, kudos to all !!
Thanks,
Marty
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RE: de venomized
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by FlaSnakeHunter on September 7, 2007
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Additionally, something just occurred to me:
Karl, it is a fact that some venoms literally decompose tissue and this could be construed as a form of digestion, however, some venoms do little, if anything at all in terms of proteolysis. On the other hand, ALL venoms act to either subdue and/or kill, especially so for prey items.
If I am correct in my observations, i.e. that venom evolved as a means for the predator animal to secure it's prey, then it is no different evolutionarily from constrictors who have evolved a specialized musculature (and they bite as a means of defense)or those snakes, like Drymarchon, who have evolved incredibly powerful jaw musculature such that they easily overpower their prey (and they are fast and can escape potential threats).
I think it's all about survival; first and foremost, like every living thing on this planet, a snake must eat, everything else is secondary.
Thanks,
Marty
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RE: de venomized
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by Jahon on September 10, 2007
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I agree that venomous snakes do not always inject venom and can digest their prey perfectly fine without venom. When my C. stephensi feeds on baby mice that "appear" dead when they are not moving, he never injects venom. I know this because he keeps and keeps trying to eat it alive. Until in the end, when it grows tired of the mouse struggling, it takes 1 bite, releases, and lets the venom kill it. However, when he is fed adult mice he does the classic bite and release, so I would have to highly disagree with you earthguy. However, mind you, I am highly against venomoids because of the fact that quite frankly if you cannot handle a venomous snake then don't get one! Period!
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