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RE: EFFECTS OF RATTLESNAKE ROUNDUPS ON THE EDB
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by atwageman on September 5, 2009
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With advance notice I would be glad to volunteer my time to man a table or booth. In my local community I offer a nusiance snake removal service, and at that time I always make a point to talk to folks about the positive benefits of snakes.
I find rationaly talking to people can go a long way. Sure with some you'll never change their minds. But not everyone who hates/misunderstands snakes that shows up to these roundups is a neanderthal and those are the folks we need to target.
With the economy the way it has been for the last year, many folks are taking daycations instead of long trips and going to more local attractions like roundups, zoos, amusement parks etc. Like others have said, supporting these small communities in other areas may help too.
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RE: EFFECTS OF RATTLESNAKE ROUNDUPS ON THE EDB
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by Cro on September 5, 2009
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Karl,
Well, let me revise my incorrect comments a bit then.
I remembered a photo of you and the Boss manning a table from one of the old Rattle publications. I assumed that it was an effort on your, and the SHHS, to to do something about rattlesnake roundups, but did not have the publication handy to double check my memory.
So, I will change that statement to "In the past, folks from the SHHS, like Karl Betz, did set up information tables at some of the FORMER roundups." How's that ?
Or, perhaps, "Karl Betz set up a SHHS information table at the Wild Chicken Festival."
It is unfortunate that you have never attended a real roundup. I think that only by seeing one first hand, will people be able to learn just what might reach the folks there, and what might not. Perhaps the SHHS should have tried setting up a table at Claxton ?
As far as my statement about the Georgia Herp Society, I still consider them more of a Turtle Society. I know that Mark likes snakes, and I know that Johnny Hester has done a huge amount of work exhibiting his snakes from time to time, to try to help educate folks.
In years past, under the leadership of a certain turtle fanatic, that society had several years where its membership was about 85% turtle society, and most of the folks who liked snakes got fed up and left. During that time, the current very restrictive reptile laws we have in GA were passed, and that is largely due the turtle folks derailing efforts from the snake folks to prevent those laws from passing. But, I won't get into that, as it is ancient history.
My views of that GA Herp Society are based on watching its membership change over the last 37 or 38 years, and from having served as President or Vice President of it several times in the past, as well as being Editor of the Bulletin for a number of years.
Since you do not know what the society was like way back then, Karl, it is probably difficult for you to view it as I do, because you have not seen the changes it has been through over all those years. How long have you been involved with the GHS ?
Oh, by the way, way back in the 70's, before the turtle folks took over the GA Herp Society, we did set up educational exhibits at several of the rattlesnake roundups over a period of several years. Whether it made any difference is hard to say. It is all documented in the old copies of the Bulletin of the Georgia Herp Society, complete with photos of some of us manning a GHS table and live exhibit at the roundups. Back then, there were at least a few folks from that society willing to try to make a difference.
I wonder why Mark Patterson has not set up educational displays at the various rattlesnake roundups here in GA ? After all, he has been President of the society for several years now, hasn't he ? After all, you say he is a snake guy. Perhaps it goes back to the idea you mentioned that folks now days want to be paid to set up a exhibit ? Also, it would probably be difficult to sell books and such at a roundup. Much easier to do that at a reptile exhibit at Fernbank, or the Cobb Center, or North Atlanta Trade Center ?
As far as Jason Clark, I am not saying that he would have any chance at all in stopping the roundups. I am saying that if he were there talking with folks, that some of them might listen to a different viewpoint, especially if they have seen him on TV. He might reach some of the kids there, and perhaps some of those kids in those towns, who are destined to be the next generation of rattlesnake roundup folks, might decide that there are better ways to draw folks to the towns.
Perhaps some of them will see the success that the Wild Chicken Fest has had, and decide they can make more money with a arts and crafts fest ?
Or, perhaps not.
Best Regards
John Z
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RE: EFFECTS OF RATTLESNAKE ROUNDUPS ON THE EDB
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by Buzztail1 on September 5, 2009
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No problem at all, John.
Perhaps my tone sounded harsher than it was intended to.
The GA Herp Society, which I have only been associated with for the past 5 years or so, has been doing many educational displays at festivals across Georgia for several years now. The problem which they run into is the same as with any herp society - too many events - not enough volunteers - so that the few who do support (Johnny, Mark, myself) wind up getting burned out and disillusioned.
The article to which you refer with pictures of myself and The Boss was in the Spring 2003 edition of "The Rattle". It was an article that I wrote and one that was quite critical of the lack of participation of many of the people who were "members" here who posted how they were against rattlesnake roundups but when given the opportunity to help out - they were nowhere to be found.
That newsletter is available in pdf format in our file library for download:
http://www.venomousreptiles.org/libraries/Sample%20Newsletters
Sorry if I seemed overly critical in my reply.
We do agree that roundups are bad.
Unfortunately, I have seen way too many people who are very vocal about criticizing them right up until they have the opportunity to do something about them - then they are busy.
R/
Karl
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RE: EFFECTS OF RATTLESNAKE ROUNDUPS ON THE EDB
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by ChuckHurd on September 5, 2009
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Thanks guys, but all I did was post it, these other people did the work.
I went to Op, AL few years ago. It is nothing more then a concert. Break the music and dancing 2 or 3 times and let some local idiots parade some diamonds around. They announced over and over that the snakes would be released at the end of the festival, but that was a lie. They had a large dark female, around 6 feet. She appeared gravid. My buddy Randy offered the handle $100 for her, and he told Randy they had already sold the group to a skin company.
From what I saw there, the snakes could be easily removed from the show. Everyone was about the concert. They could have some of us bring in a local snake display and talk about this, would be the same affect.
One confusing point about the whole matter is, one of the local idiots that partakes in the spectacle is named “Chris Harper.” What are the odds? I wasn’t really minding the whole event right up till they told Randy the snakes were going for skins.
On a side bar, I rarely ever agree with John on anything, but the GHS is turtle crazy. Perhaps some of them do have snakes, but that is kept as a dirty little secret. All the contact I have had with them, turtles of one sort or another is all I have ever heard them talk about.
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RE: EFFECTS OF RATTLESNAKE ROUNDUPS ON THE EDB
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by Cro on September 5, 2009
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Chuck, it is good to know that we can agree on some things from time to time, LOL. I guess the common love for reptiles is what it really is about.
And what you said Karl about getting burnt out trying to get folks to help is very, very true. But, that was always the case, and most likely will continue to be.
Way back years ago, even with a very snake oriented herp society, it was still very difficult to get 6 or 7 folks to go to a roundup, and set up displays and help out.
And, if Johnny Hester had been paid for all of the work he has put in for free over the years trying to educate folks about snakes, he would be a very wealthy man now. Of anyone in Georgia, Johnny has probably devoted more of his time, at no charge, than anyone else ever has to help the cause.
Part of the problem with a herp society like the GHS, is that it is now too spread out over the metro area, and meetings are just too far for folks to attend.
Back when we had the meetings at the Zoo, that was kind of a central location, and, it had the added advantage that the meetings were often followed by a tour of the reptile building, where folks could see the newly acquired animals, or, new animals that had been born.
Something like a herp society in a small town, with 20 members who were really dedicated just might still work. But, many large cites are just too big these days to have a herp society. Plus, now days, folks have a lot of extra stuff, like one kid is in karate, and one in soccer, and another is in the school band.
And they all need rides. So, no, there is not time to take the herp loving kid to a herp society meeting way across town, because little sis still has soccer, and little bro still has karate to get to that same night, etc.
It is a different world than what we grew up in.
Best Regards
John Z
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