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RE: Ven. Community Spotlight
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by TCH_Zoological on August 19, 2005
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Might I remind everyone that the rattlesnake man himself, Laurence Klauber was an engineer by trade and a herpetologist second. He was also a consulting curator of reptiles as the San Diego ZOO!
I would agree with Doug, some herpetologists happen to be employed at a zoos. But being a zookeeper does not mean the person is a herpetologist. Also, there is no degree for herpetology and therefore many 'herpetologists' are actually biologists or zoologists by degree. I personally don't feel that a person must limit themselves to one or two classes of animals in order to be considered a professional. I mostly study crotalidae but I do work with invertebrates, mammals and others. Does that make my work with herps less important? NO! Of course quantitiy sometimes sacrafices quality but that is not always the case.
Regardless of Irwin's interests in other classes of animals he should still be represented here. For pete's sake his title is "The Crocodile Hunter" which begins with a herp (almost a bird some would argue..lol). Anyhow, I don't think anyone has become as well known for handling venomous snakes better than him. Almost any john doe knows who Irwin is and that he has handled venomous snakes. His shows are discussed around the water cooler and that makes the man sucessful in spreading the interest of reptiles. He should be on the list.
Also, I'm mildly disappointed that the Ven. Community Spotlight has basically been directed toward card carrying, book publishing, herpetologists only. Of course a few tv guys got in as well. I would be far more interested in reading about the work some of the private keepers do as well as professional ones. Of course, I give my full respect to the scientists spotlighted, but I read about them every time a pick up a peered reviewed journal. The only way I'll hear about private keepers is when they post an ad or question on this site and then I read their profile. They are the more 'down home' community members if you ask me. Jeff Corwin or Bill Haast has never stopped by my house to check out my new herp.
Anyhow that's my 2 cents.
T.C.
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RE: Ven. Community Spotlight
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by tj on August 19, 2005
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Being a zookeeper doesn't make one a herpetologist, I agree. That was my point to begin with.
"Also, there is no degree for herpetology and therefore many 'herpetologists' are actually biologists or zoologists by degree."
Actually, there are quite a few schools that have masters and doctorate level degrees in herpetology.
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RE: Ven. Community Spotlight
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by TCH_Zoological on August 19, 2005
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Please show me the corriculum that states Docotor of Philosophy in Herpetology or Masters of Science in Herpetology. As far as I know this doesn't exist. But hey what do I know I'm just a zoology senior, whose looking into grad school. :-)
There courses offered at many schools in herpetology and you can study herps as your research projeect BUT the degree given is NOT in herpetology it is either in biology, zoology, or wildlife. That is the case with all the universities I know of in the US. I am more than happy to be proven wrong but I would like names of schools and proof! I.E. please show me a school the puts Master of Science in Herpetology on the degree handed out and I will retract my statement.
Thanks,
T.C.
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RE: Ven. Community Spotlight
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by timberrattlesnake89 on August 19, 2005
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To Tj and everyone else,
The species that Steve Irwin discovered was a Turtle found in Northern Australia. The name of it is Elseya irwini. He has been sucessful at breeding some of the most endagered animals in the world. I great example is the Fuji Island Iguana. In my book I think he should deffinately be able to be on the spot light. You have mention many people who don't wear the SHHS t-shirt. Also you talk about how Steve is so against keeping animals. That is not true at all. But then again you most of you have thought Jim Harrison is great but then again he is the one who has spoke a lot more strongly against our hobby than Steve every has.
Phillip
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RE: Ven. Community Spotlight
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by ALA_herp31 on August 19, 2005
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You also have to remember, that Mr. Irwin is totally and surly against Privet Keeping. Strikes me funny that he himself had to have started somewhere, I am sure at one time he also Kept and Caught His Own Wild Snakes to Keep in His Park “ this would be a contradiction of His Own Beliefs, wouldn’t you say”? I strongly disagree with Steve Irwin being put in the Spot Light, His Name dose not belong among us. I think that if He is against Privet Keeping, then He has no place on this Web Site. This is just my opinion, I see anyone that is against our Hobby, to be an Outsider.................Be Safe Ya’ll, Happy Herping : Wally
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RE: Ven. Community Spotlight
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by Dadee on August 20, 2005
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Let me point out just a few aspects of what has been brought up here.
1. Steve Irwin has discovered a few new species of herps - Perhaps he has, but as CH has pointed out, he has yet to respond to any inquiries, or commented on his "SHHS T-Shirt" (the same of which a good chunk of us have never been given - not a bitch, but more of a point), truth be told Steve is against private herpers *hark, do I hear in my little ear the initials JH?*
2. Zoo keepers not being Herpetologists has been claimed. Well just as I pointed out above, JH is a zookeeper and is labeled as a Herpetologist. This is not to say that ALL zookeepers are Herpetologists mind you, but as Tube Sock Al pointed out, using such a broad brush to paint a water color painting isn't the best method to employ. Doug Hotle has been a Herpetologist for more years than most of us, me included, even with my 20 years. Some of the zookeepers, I agree, could not in the wildest of imaginations be labeled as Herpetologists. At the National Zoo, we do have a Herpetologist that takes care of all the vens, even prepping them for their vet exams, but not all Zoos can make this claim.
In summary, some of the people that are being thrown up as needing to be on our spotlight list, need to be examined a little more to determine whether they fit "OUR" community. Even though a person does make some new discoveries in the field of herpetology, is this the only prerequisite for being in our spotlight list of notables? What are the prerequisites? Shouldn't all of the prerequisites be met in order for us to list them?
Herpetology can be the hobby of many folk from all walks of life. Some individuals may be employed by one of those industries who want us banned, but yet are included in our community of private keepers who can be called Herpetologists. A good percentage of those who tend to be labeled as I've stated above, can and probably have been mislabeled. In short, often, good cells live amongst the cancers.
Take care,
Matt
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RE: Ven. Community Spotlight
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by ALA_herp31 on August 20, 2005
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Matt, you are correct. Take me for example, I worked as the Head Reptile & Amphibian Curator at Limestone Co. Zoological Park. As for me, I never attended College, and would never label myself as a Herpetologist. Now, I know a few Zoo Keepers that never went to College and do call themselves Herpetologist. I think this is a way to make themselves seem Higher Educated than others, who knows?.......................Be Safe Ya’ll, Happy Herping :Wally
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RE: Ven. Community Spotlight
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by MoccasinMan on August 20, 2005
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I like Irwin. He is one of the best handlers in the world. His advocacy of wildlife world wide is well known. Over the last decade he has educated countless people and been a positive force in changing cultural bias and antiquated stereotypes. If it is true that he is against private ownership, I am suprised and disappointed.
No one responded as to why Dean and Roark were not included. They are both experts, advocates of private ownership, and members of this community.
Andrew
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RE: Ven. Community Spotlight
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by MoccasinMan on August 20, 2005
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TJ has many strong opinions and much "wisdom". In my opinion he is the same as an anonymous poster... lots of criticism and no background or identity.
Andrew
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RE: Ven. Community Spotlight
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by Rabies on August 21, 2005
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We appear to be drifting away here and are on the verge of a conflict. As stated by CH if you think you know some body worthy for posting, submit a photo with a profile and let the moderators decide! And except their decision.
John
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