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Glass Terrariums fro vipers
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by snakemau on October 19, 2005
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Has anybody used one of the Glass Terrariums made by Exoterra for arboreal vipers? are they secure?
Any comments on the product?
thanks
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RE: Glass Terrariums fro vipers
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by Frawgg on October 19, 2005
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Here we go again!! Al, I'll try to save you some time by answering this question to the best of my abilities. Glass aquariums are not the safest material to house venomous snakes. Glass breaks. Plastic caging is far superior to glass because of its resilience to accidental damage. While I do house Aspidelaps in aquariums, I have thoroughly studied the species I keep & have taken a CALCULATED risk housing them in a glass cage. My aquariums are sufficiently tall enough that IF I ever forgot (God forbid!) to secure the lid, the snakes could not ascend to the top (as they are a terrestrial/ semi-fossorial species). I don't place my faith entirely in this estimation and I triple check that all locks are secured to the lid before & especially after I leave the room. I do agree with Al that I should house my snakes in a plastic environment. I really haven't found a plastic cage that I am particularly enthusiastic about, but www.precisioncaging.com seems to have a decent system. Any others Al?
Housing arboreal vipers, a few branches must be placed in the cage. By having branches in the cage, the vipers will be within escapeing distance to the top of the cage. I am not familiar with Exo-terra wether they are top opening or front slide opening etc...I personally like sliding top lids opposed to sliding front doors. Working above the snake puts the reptile at a disadvantage. Sliding front doors put the reptile at an even playing field and makes manipulating the snake more difficult. I imagine this topic will be highly debated.
This brings me to my second point. I STRONGLY advise a snake room devoted entirely to the housing of venomous species... preferrably housed seperately from your abode. The snake room must be kept free of clutter (books, equipment, etc...) so, if in case the reptile did escape, recapturing the animal could be facilitated as safely as possible. Did you see the post & photo on kingsnake.com about the guy who is housing a black mamba in a 55 gallon aquarium with all the clutter within the room? That is a perfect example of what NOT to do! The door entering the snake room should be locked and a threshold should also be installed under the door to prevent snakes from escaping under the door. Tile should be used as your choice for flooring material. Ideally, a glass window should be installed in the door entering the snake room so the keeper can survey safety conditions before entering the snake room. Air conditioner vents need to be blocked off and secured with wire mesh.
No matter what you decide, safety is paramount to you and more importantly, to others. Just because you want to take the risk of housing venomous reptiles doesn't mean others are willing to take those risks. Hey guys,what is the average medical cost for treating a venomous bite? Happy herpin' and be safe!
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RE: Glass Terrariums for vipers
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by snakemau on October 19, 2005
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Hey Frawgg,
Thanks for your comments. Surely I agree with you safety first and the medical bills are huge!! My concern with these new aquariums (by exoterra) is that it seems that they could work for small species. They do have front opening doors and a screen top, however, I haven't seen one of these cages personally and I just wanted to figure out if somebody has used them before and what they think about them. I agree that the best cages are made of plastic (like the Neodesha cages) but try to find one of those for sale! Based on info from this forum, the Vision cages seems to be a good option if you seal the upper lip, however glass aquariums seems to be the winner choice for many keepers. I had use glass aquariums before on small vipers and they work great!
Any way, thanks for your comment. This is a very good forum and excellent learning tool.
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RE: Glass Terrariums fro vipers
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by captiveherps on October 19, 2005
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The front doors have a lock mech that seems fairly strong. I dont think that anything that would be suitable to keep in a tank that size could overpower it. The screen top is secured by four latches, it could be secured with silicone if escape was a concern. I would prefer a second layer of screen for extra safty. I have 2 of the 18x18x24 size. A friend of mine has recently purchased a number of them for his warehouse.
The rest of my tanks are plastic with key locks, they were used for retail display. I got a number of them from Pet Stuff when they bankrupted in Canada.
The cages from boaphile seem ok, but I have not seen them in person.
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RE: Glass Terrariums fro vipers
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by Phobos on October 19, 2005
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Hi Everyone:
Yeah Mike...let's have somemore cage talk :-) I do like the Precisions cages they are as about "escape proof" as possible. They are easy to clean and stackable. Not very expensive and Lovell Romans is easy to work with and will make it to your liking. I have 7 of the "small cages", perfect for snakes you absolutely don't want to get out, like my Echis collection.
Since I don't like discussions in a "Vacuum" and knowledge is power, here is the link to see and learn what the thread is about:
http://www.exo-terra.com/EN/products/glass_terrariums_i.html
I actually think these would be very nice for small arboreal vipers like Eyelash & Bush Vipers. I would not keep very fast Elapids in them but Arboreal viperid snakes in the half meter length (18-24 inches)range it could work nice. I could see my Atheris nitschei in these because you can have a nice pool of water and good air flow because of the screened top. All vital for these difficult to keep arboreal "water snake"
All of this is subject to me seeing one and not changing my mind about the design.
Al
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RE: Glass Terrariums fro vipers
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by elapidking81 on October 19, 2005
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I personally havent used the cages from www.precisioncaging.com but they look great and have great options like lockable cages and they do have 2 very nice aborial cages, thing I like the most is the price they have very reasonable prices. here are some spec's for the large, and then the smaller one.
36" length x 20" depth x 30" height. This cage is designed for arboreal snakes and lizards. The 30" height offers a greater area for climbing and cage furnishings. The aesthetic appeal of this enclosure produces a true showpiece for your valued animals. The high design also allows for a greater temperature gradient producing a more suitable environment for more difficult species. It contains two doors that are side-hinged for easy access. This unit comes standard with 2 incandescent light fixtures. This enclosure is perfect for all arboreal or semi-arboreal reptiles. Shipping is $75.00 each UPS.
$300.00
24" length x 20" depth x 24" height. This cage is designed for arboreal animals. The 24" height offers a greater area for climbing and cage furnishings. The aesthetic appeal of this enclosure produces a true showpiece for your valued animals. The high design also allows for a greater temperature gradient producing a more suitable environment for more difficult species. Additional security latches are installed and the door is side-hinged for easy access. This enclosure is perfect for all arboreal or semi-arboreal reptiles. Shipping is $36.00 each UPS.
$160.00
and add $12.50 for the locks, but I would definatly check out the web site.
shane
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RE: Glass Terrariums fro vipers
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by snakemau on October 19, 2005
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First my apologies for not including the web address of the cages in question. Thank you Phobos for sending the web address.
Now, I just checked the Precision cages website and indeed the prices are not bad and the cages seem to be pretty good. My only concern is that it seems that the only position for the light fixtures is inside the cage, which with arboreal snakes it could means that some snakes may get burn by direct contact with the heat source correct? Phobos you use this cages, so is that a possible problem?
I guess if I get one of these cages I could request to have an opening at the top where I can set and external heat/light source.
But again, I would like to see the cages too.
Mau
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RE: Glass Terrariums fro vipers
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by Phobos on October 20, 2005
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Mau:
Like I said, Lovell will change the fixturing to your liking.
I use Pro-Product Heat panels ( http://www.pro-products.com/ ) that are efficient and safe for the snakes. I have it hooked up to a temp controller to maintain a specific temp.
For lighting I use ESU Reptile Slimline Light Strip 18.25 in. x 4 in. x 1.75
Best,
Al
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RE: Glass Terrariums fro vipers
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by Frawgg on October 20, 2005
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I checked out Exo-terra & they seem to have a decent cage. They have an asthetically appealing cage that would be good for a display. They do have a locking mechanism but I prefer a keyed locking system. I like the top opening lid. This gives the keeper the advantage being able to work over the snake. I still prefer a sliding type of entry. The biggest drawback is that it is made from glass. As I stated before I use glass caging but I prefer plastic caging. If you are careful, I don't see a problem with using this cage for small arboreal vipers. I wouldn't use it for agile elapids. I still recommend a snake room. A single layer of wire mesh vs. a double spaced layer is somewhat of a safety concern.
Hinged doors vs. sliding doors...That is the BIGGEST concern I have with ALL commercially manufactured cages currently on the market. Hinged doors simply allow too much of an escape area to be exposed. The manufacturers who do use a sliding door use tracks to facilitate this feature. The problem is that there is a space between the two panes of glass that could allow the reptile to escape. If they (the manufacturers) would incorporate a single pane of glass that would slide either way (left or right) INTO the front face & top of the actual cage itself, this problem would be eliminated. This would allow a valuable option for the keeper to be able to gain access to the safest area of the cage depending on the situation.
EXTERNAL trap/catch box system. I know of no manufacturer who incorporates this system into their design. If you have to place a catch box into the cage, by doing so, you have already exposed yourself to possible danger. I have seen an external trap/catch box system used by the Sacremento Zoo in Dr. Fredric L. Frye's book: Reptile Care, Volume 1, pages 21 & 24. (ISBN 0-86622-215-4) that is as close to perfection as I have seen anywhere. I've contacted the Sacremento Zoo years ago looking for the manufacturer, but I couln't extract any information out of them. If anyone knows where I could get a cage like this, BY ALL MEANS, LET ME KNOW!!
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