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Unpredictability in Snakes “A Fact”
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by ALA_snake33 on August 23, 2006
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I wouldn’t exactly say that Large Cottonmouths can’t move fast with its Head Held up a Little High. The reason I say this, is because the Cottonmouth I caught back a Few Months ago, did raise its Head about 5 - 6 Inches off the Ground after I let it go and it was a 4Ft. Snake. If the Snake wants to get away bad enough, it will do things you least expect it to.
I would never say that any Snake would not show certain behaviors. If life has taught us anything, it is that Life is Unpredictable. Wild Animals can and will do things you don’t expect “such as jumping out of a 3Ft. Deep Cage, just to grab a Mouse, then hit the Floor wile doing it ” I had a 31/2 Ft. Cottonmouth do this to me Once wile Working with the Zoo.
So, I would beg to differ with anyone who tells me a Snake can’t do something “ I know better”. I am by no means trying to be an A## here, but I have to disagree with the “Can’t Do Mentality” expressed here.
Sorry if I sound rough with this, I just get so Tired of hearing People in the Scientific and Venomous Community say that an Animal can’t do something that People see them do.
By the way, I have been Herping for a Few Years myself, and have never had a Problem distinguishing between a Racer and a Cottonmouth “especially during the Day, even up to 40Ft. away”.
Be Safe Ya’ll, Happy Herping : Wally
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RE: HUGE Cottonmouth
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by Voided37 on August 24, 2006
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Ok, OK...
So noone here has actually taped one that long. Too bad, because he's real, they can get that long, and as those that aren't too skeptical have expessed, if i get the chance i'll definitely get proof before i bring it up here again.
Racer...PLEASE...A short glance proves the difference between the two species.
So gentlemen, we're all snake fanciers here and it's such a delight to speak with folks who aren't irrationally afraid of one of God's neater creatures[to me]. So have a good night[or day]and if i ever get proof you'll see it here first.
And i'd like to say thanks for appreciating these critters[hot herps]like i do.
Stephen D. Melton
PS, my email is listed so if anyone else sees one this long i'd love to hear about it. Thanks.
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RE: HUGE Cottonmouth
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by earthguy on August 24, 2006
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Easy there Stephen!
Yes, we are a bit skeptical, but that's because this is a relatively scientific community. Most of us have a good bit of experience with these snakes - and people claiming things outside of the norm. My next door neighbor at work swears that he witnessed his best friend jumping into a nest of "water moccasins" - he watched his friend die. He is now mortally afraid of the snakes that I keep in my room, despite the fact that I tell him that cottonmouths WILL NOT nest by the dozens in the water just to swarm poor hapless swimmers. I beleive his friend jumped into the water (thus creating a vortex which pulled a snake or two out of their cover), hit his head and drowned. I'll never convince him of that, though. I also think that you saw probably saw a big (~6') cottonmouth, but I really don't think that you saw a seven footer. Skepticism is natural in science. Is it possible that you saw a seven footer? Yes. Is it probable? No. If you get the proof, everyone on this site who has doubted will gladly recend (in fact, you'll have a lot of instant "buddies" who will revel in the fact that they know the guy who holds the world record for the largest cottonmouth on record). Just understand that our skepticism isn't personal - its scientific. Prove us wrong, PLEASE!
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RE: HUGE Cottonmouth
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by Voided37 on August 24, 2006
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Easy there Earthguy...LOLOL
As soon as i quit laughing....
I understand completely, friend. And i appreciate the responses i got from all. I think after this i would still report it again exactly how i THINK i saw it. Since i didn't have a tape measure [or proof] and didn't realize till i looked up the record length what an outstanding, hard to believe thing it was. He[it]was truly awesome, the grandaddy of all of them i'd ever seen. And that's why i turned around and left after admiring him for a few minutes. I just figured maybe amongst long time herpers i could find at least one who had actually seen a specimen long as i had.
Most anyone else down there in that area shooting for pleasure as i was that day woulda had the proof although it would of been missing the head but shooting him never entered my mind. And i'd never do that anyhow. As i said though the first opportunity i get to show off one of the bigger specimens from there without stressing them[or me]i will.
Thanks again ya'll. And i apologize for getting irritated with yall's disbelief. I wouldn't have believed it either without seeing it.
I'll be talking to ya'll later. As this is the best herp site i've found on the 'net.
See ya', friends.
steve
PS, they lay on the roads come early fall as temps cool at night. I'll do some riding and post some pic's of what a great [Cottonmouth] moccasin area Anderson-Tully is.[It's on the map near Fort Pillow State Park historical area, TN.]
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RE: HUGE Cottonmouth
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by thenovice on August 24, 2006
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it sounds like you live in a relativly rural area, it certainly IS possible, but as earthguy said, we are scientific and always want proof.
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RE: HUGE Cottonmouth
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by Cro on August 24, 2006
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When I was a kid age 7 or 8, we went to the shopping plaza, along with all the other neighborhood kids, to see ``Mr. Height,`` John F. Carroll, who was 8'7.75" tall. He was the second tallest human ever recorded.
He made his living traveling around the country to shopping center openings, etc.
Oversized individuals do sometimes turn up. In humans, in snakes, in plants, in almost any living creature.
I have encountered a Weastern Diamond-back Rattlesnake in extreme South Texas that was over 7 feet long, a Florida Cottonmouth that was over 6 feet long, a Eastern Diamond-back Rattlesnake that was over 7 feet long, and several Copperheads over 4 feet long. I have also found a road killed Dusky Pygmy rattlesnke that was 34 inches long, which is 3 inches longer than the recorded world record. Unfortunatly, I did not know it was a record at the time, so left if for the vultures and crows. That is in many, many years of road cruising and field collecting, though.
Those individual snakes were very, very rare individual cases, involving snakes that had somehow survived predators and man for many, many years.
We know that snakes and lizards and crocodiles keep growing all through their lives, even though growth slows as the animals age. We also know from captive records that pit-vipers can live in captivity in excess of 35 years. That is how we wind up with 19 foot, 75 year old crocks !
Is it so difficult to believe that a grandpa snake who lived many, many years, and who had superior genetics, and avoided man, and had a great food resource could reach a giant size?
That is why I believe a 7 foot Cottonmouth is possible, although extremely unlikely, because I have seen some oversized snakes in years past.
Many accounts of giant snakes are overstated, and they tend to shrink when the tape measure comes out. But, I will still give this story the benefit of the doubt, for no other reason than I hope such a snake exists, LOL ! However, I still want to see the photos, or the actual snake !
Best Regards JohnZ
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RE: HUGE Cottonmouth
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by ALA_snake33 on August 24, 2006
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First off I would like to apologize for my A## Holeish attitude in the last Post. I do trust Science in most part but, some in the Scientific Community do have a “Know It All” Mentality, by this I mean they think that life is Predictable “I think we all know better tho”. At least I hope we do.
Stephen : I do believe you, because I know that the Swamps along the Mississippi River are Prime Area for finding Large “and I do mean Large” Cottonmouth. It is somewhat the same here in Limestone Co., Alabama. We have some Swamps here, that probably haven’t seen the Foot of a Man in 20 Years. The reason for this, is that most People wouldn’t want to Stray that far off Track.
On the other hand, I am one that loves to Spend Hours “if not Days” looking through these Old Back Wood Swamps. It would really surprise some People how many Strange and Unusual Animals you will find that far from Man. If they would only try it.
Be Safe Ya’ll, Happy Herping : Wally
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RE: HUGE Cottonmouth
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by Voided37 on August 24, 2006
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Hey, JohnZ and Wally,
both of you hit the nail on the head. Exceptional individuals amongst every specie and many years kicking thru the least trodden area's. My thing has always been off the beaten track and further than most have the nads to go. Where i go exploring i've heard folks claim that there's mountain lions and black bears...And i have to admit that i never believed them either!! Although looking at a map and realizing what animals will do after dark i guess there could have been some of those actually wind up there. But the 'experts' would never believe it and i took it with a grain of salt.
The guy claiming he had the black bear tree him also said he ran the bear off with a tobacco spit to the eye.....LOL. WOULD ANYBODY BELIEVE THAT??
As far as the cougars even the wildlife people admit there might be some credence to that.
In any case happy hunting you two. And you'll hear from me again.
Steve
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RE: HUGE Cottonmouth
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by Voided37 on August 24, 2006
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To all those that would consider themselves an expert.
Please don't think i am putting down your experience, your expertise, the years you've devoted to your field of study, any schooling you've taken, or the money you've spent pursuing your field. I'm not at all. Actually i appreciate it.
What i would say is that those folks with an open mind in any field are the ones that are still learning and viable because they realize they don't know it all, none of us do, so they are still growing in their field. Those that be-live [believe] that they have seen it all and know it all in their respective fields are no longer growing and have cut themselves off to any new opportunities for growth and learning. And in a non-static world where one is either growing, at fruition, or dying, how do we want to be?
Thanks again everybody. As Wally says, be safe...And happy herping!
steve
PS, i forgot to mention that in TN it is illegal to get caught [lol] capturing snakes or having them without a permit. And they won't issue permits from what i understand. Isn't that dirty, lowdown and underhanded?
'My country tis of thee, every time i turn around you screw me...'
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RE: HUGE Cottonmouth
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by j9 on January 11, 2012
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Not sure if anyone will get this post. My brother sent this picture to the Atlanta zoo of a snake that was shot in south georgia. They stated that it is a copperhead. I do not know the length myself, but it appears to be over 6ft. I just put the photo in Forum Storage. I do not know how to post pictures, but the picture is of a guy holding a huge snake with a stick, and two shotguns are up against a tree in the back. The title of the picture in Cottonmouth.
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