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rattlesnake relocation
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by rattlesnakeremover on December 6, 2002
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can rattlesnakes be removed from one den to another and use their new den year after year or will they be lost? Or does anyone really know? If I'm not mistaken Bill Haast created his own make-shift den in his backyard that is walled-in for snakes and they are still alive. 1 More Question. How has power over TWRA(Tennessee Wildlife Resource Agency)? I think they are handling the crotalus horridus's population in the wrong way.
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RE: rattlesnake relocation
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by GREGLONGHURST on December 6, 2002
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I really cannot answer your question, but I have one thing to mention. The area Bill Haast is in is not an area where rattlesnakes den up. I live in the same basic area...southeast of him..and nothing dens up here. Extreme north Florida, yes, but not here.
~~Greg~~
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RE: rattlesnake relocation
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by levi3 on December 6, 2002
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I live in north central WVa. I have a friend in the southern part of the state that made a make shift den by fencing off an area with 1/4 inch wire. He dug a hole down about 4 feet and placed a rubbermaid trash can. He ran pvc pipe from the trash can to the surface. Every year he puts his timbers and coppers in the den as he has no other place to house them. All his snakes are wild caught and he has snakes that he has kept for the past five years this way. He just goes up in the spring and recatches them so to answer your question, I think if it comes to freezing to death or sliding down a warm hole they will reden. I have had DNR people tell me they wont but obviously they will. I hope this helps.
Ray
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RE: rattlesnake relocation
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by rattlesnakeremover on December 7, 2002
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Hey Ray, Thanks for the information I agree with you.
TWRA thinks I'm wrong. They rather not issue permits to a herp to advertise free removal instead they want the public to leave the snake alone or kill it. It is a law in TN no hunting, collecting, or relocating of snakes with out a permit and only 2 colleges have the permit which neither are near. The person I spoke with at TWRA said they are happy with the way things are about rattlers and other snakes, it's been working fine for the last 10 years. I guess TWRA does not study the data because the timber population in TN shows its not working at all.
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RE: rattlesnake relocation
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by levi3 on December 9, 2002
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The WVa DNR told me that timbers were going down hill quick and that in a few years they would be in real trouble but I dont totally agree. I have absoultly no problem finding timbers . In fact last year I looked like crazy for a couple coppers and all I could find were timbers! There is alot of sensless killings go on up here but to say they snakes are in real trouble or about to be extinct..............I DONT THINK SO!!!!!!! The DNR tells you what they want you to think. They said a timber would freeze to death before redenning. wrong again!!!
Later Ray
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RE: rattlesnake relocation
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by rattlesnakeremover on December 10, 2002
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Hi Ray, I agree with you about the snakes redenning. That's what I'm trying to get TWRA to see. But it is the opposite with coppers and timbers, here timbers are harder to find than coppers.
I have the FWS and SSAR involved in my battle against TWRA. I will overcome one way or the other.
Thanks Mike
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RE: rattlesnake relocation
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by Kristen on December 11, 2002
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I am doing radiotelemetry research on C. horridus here in KY for my graduate project. During the research phase of my work, I discovered several papers that point to nothing good coming from relocating any snake, especially an adult. The reason snakes in captivity seem to do ok is for a couple of reasons: first, if there is no where else to go (a fence keeps them from crawling away from the area) then they will probably stay there, plus a captive snake is much less stressed by being handled than a wild snake is. A captive snake has been handled before, it's been fed, etc. and so is less likely to feak out and try to escape from the general area than a wild snake would be. A wild snake WILL NOT stay in an area it is translocated to. It will simply try to get back to its home range, and die in the process if that range is too far away.
One thing you can do is move the snake a short distance, like a 50 or 100 yards. The snake may view the encounter as a succesful predator escape, and may avoid the area of capture because it thinks there are predators (=people) there. The snake is removed from people and it is still in its home range.
You might want to check out John Sealy's work in NC.
Also, there is a review article somewhere about conservation strategys for herps that discusses translocation and has several references in it. We all want to preserve the snakes, but all available evidence points to moving them is equal to kiling them.
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by rattlesnakeremover on December 11, 2002
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In TX, I have a friend who has relocated w diamondback and has been succesful with no fences. There can not be that much difference between the two snakes. There are to many ways a relocation study can be done to have someone use all of them. The time of year, temp, and maybe using a fence first then removing it after 2 months. Timbers are a wild animal that does not have trip wires to tell them they are in a new spot to shut down. They will do what it takes to stay alive. I have many more ideas for research on the relocation of timbers.
Thanks
Mike
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by rattlesnakeremover on December 11, 2002
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I'm a problem solver and I don't believe everything I read or hear about simply because there are to many ways to experiment to get the right answer.
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