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shipping
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by snakesallover on April 15, 2005
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Hello
Does any body have a really good shipping company for shippment of venomous reptile? and does any body know the laws on venomous ownership in Canada?
If anyone can help it would be great.Thanks
Cliff
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RE: shipping
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by Chance on April 16, 2005
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I don't want to say anything prematurely without knowing for sure, but I believe that you can keep venomous of one form or another in most provinces in Canada. At least in some...at any rate. I know I've spoken to some Canadian hot keepers...of course there's no telling what the legality of their animals was. I'm betting they were legal though.
And as far as shipping venomous, there are two major options. The most commonly used is Delta, wherein you deliver the snake(s) to the airport and they ship it to the airport of the person receiving it. To do this, you have to be a verified shipper, which can take anywhere from weeks to months to complete, depending on how busy your Delta people are. It didn't take me very long to get verified, and it is free. Once you are verified to ship reptiles through Delta, you're verified to ship any animals through them that they handle. That's what I was told anyway. Using Delta, you can ship the animals Delta DASH, which has to be prepaid and is roughly $75 or so. There is also the option of Priority First, which can take a little longer than DASH to reach the destination (8 hrs compared to 4 hours, for instance) and is generally cheaper at around $50-65. You can send things through PF either prepaid like DASH, or c.o.d. The amount will be the same either way. Delta has numerous packing requirements for shipping snakes, such as the thickness of wood, the way in which you bag the animal(s), the number per bag, etc., but you'll learn all that after speaking to your rep.
In addition to Delta, Northwest Airlines also handles venomous shipments. The upside to NW over Delta is that you don't have to be verified to use them. The downsides include the fact that NW tends to be more expensive than Delta by anywhere from $10-30, and they don't have dropoff locations for venomous in as many areas as Delta. In my state, there are three different airports that carry shipments for NW, but luckily not a one of them accepts venomous or even snakes for that matter...lol.
There is another animal carrying company, or at least subsidiary of a company, called Pet something or other, that handles airline shipments of various animals. I don't know if they deal with snakes or venomous, but they do carry dogs, cats, various exotics, etc. I don't know much about it though so that's all I'll comment on it for now.
-Chance
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shipping by legitimate methods.
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by viandy on April 17, 2005
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Just thought I'd add a bit to this. I worked for air cargo a few years, can contribute a bit more insight.
While each airline has its own regulations, such as when animals have to be dropped off, the Live Animal Regulations, including reptiles, both venomous and nonvenomous, are regulated by the International Air Transport Association (IATA). My manual is out of date, but it is 376 pages, covering different animals, countries of destination, etc. There are explicit regulations for everything from a single queen bee, to puffins, shrimp, and, of course, reptiles. Reptiles covers 22 pages, not including those species included with fish (fishing snake, pelagic sea snake, yellow bellied sea snake). File snakes have their own container requirements. Venomous snakes have specific packaging requirements, and it is noted that "rear fanged species must be packed like the true venomous snakes, they are: Dispholidus, Thelotornis, Rhabdophis, Boiga. Some colubridae snakes with uncertain venoms or venom apparatus must be packed like the true venomous snakes, they are: Homolapsinae, Xenodontidae."
Okay, I'm droning on here, but there are seperate packing requirements for lizards broken down by SVL, others for dwarf chameleons (Rhamphoelon & Brookesia), and more.
I'm just noting this to say that it isn't generally the airlines that are demanding "excessive" packaging, but the regulations that they are supposed to follow. So if your shipment is accepted at your local airport, while enroute it may be inspected by a hardcore airline employee, or by an IATA agent, and bounced back to you. Then the accepting station has to deal with you being pissed off, your customer being pissed off, their boss being pissed off that they accepted a shipment that didn't meet regulations, and the station will be fined for that violation. It really doesn't matter that you've shipped this way 20 years with no problem, or that everyone else ships this way, or you promise never to do it again but you just ran out of crates this one time. If you can check the manual (the url I have listed is " www.iata.org/cargo/live/him ") and you have fulfilled the requirements, and are a verified shipper, there shouldn't be a problem. But, to quote the manual, if you are "shipping chameleons of 2.5-10cm in SVL" they "must be packed one per inner enclosure. Inner enclosures may be fibrous woven tubes with each open end of tube securely enclosed in a manner that can be resealed, cloth, rigid container,
or heavy gauge paper enclosures." Is it a pain for you? If so, it's also difficult for the person who has to judge whether your packaging meets requirements, while another customer is complaining about the wine they bought on vacation not being there, and a funeral home is trying to drop off a body.
I'm just trying to say that it isn't up to the individual to decide that you're an okay guy. They're stuck in the middle just like you are. Sure, if they say they can't take your shipment, find out why, and what you've got to do so they will take it. But when they pull out a book and say "heavy gauge paper should be defined as a container that is sufficient to hold specimens without escape", it isn't something they made up, it's something they're held accountable for. So find out the shipping requirements first, and be prepared to "shine the apple" a bit so they'll realize that your shipment meetts every regulation that applies.
Andy Via
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RE: shipping
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by captiveherps on April 20, 2005
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Air Canada will ship hot snakes, no problem at all. I have used many carriers to import from the USA, Europe, Africa, Indo. There are no federal laws restricting importation or possession of venomous reptiles (other than cites/ESA.) In most cities it is against the by-laws to possess venomous reptiles, but outside city limits is fine. I beleve they are banned outright in QC.
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