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NEAVB
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by MoccasinMan on December 22, 2005
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What is going on with NEAVB? Is it dead in the water? It was a great idea. Without ready affordable access to AV this hobby is going to suffer in the long run.
Andrew
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RE: NEAVB
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by MattHarris on December 22, 2005
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No, its a slow process to make sure every thing is done in the proper manner. I would still recommend you keep your own supplies of a/v ( I am rather than relying on NEAVB) We will not, however, be stocking any a/v to cover North AMerican crotalids.
MCH
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RE: NEAVB
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by MattHarris on December 22, 2005
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Well, it has nothing to do with what people keep and more with the fact that Protherics is not supportive of the A/V bank for native antivenoms, giving the excuse that they believe it is more important to have a/v directly at the treatment facility, rather than at a bank. They don't relize, however, that the NEAVB, will be holding serum at a medical facility (unlike Miami-Dade's bank, which I believe keeps their reserves at Miami-Dade Fire Rescue facilities), so this really doesn't make sense.
Also, the cost of Crofab, may make the membership fees for the bank substantially more. It's already nearly impossible for keepers to fork out $500 for exotic antisera(although they don't bat an eye at throwing that kind of money for a cobra) so it's not realistic to have to stock $15,000 worth of serum for a bite when many regional medical centers already supply CROFAB. That $15,000 will be more efficiently spent on African/South American/Central American/Asian sera instead.
Al(Phobos) can likely elaborate on the CROFAB situation, and the possibilities of stocking BIOCLON in the future for N.A. Crotalids.
MCH
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RE: NEAVB
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by LarryDFishel on December 22, 2005
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OK, I'll say it so the guys actually working on building the AV bank don't have to risk making enemies...
Prothereics can sell more AV by convincing every hospital that they need their own supply than by centralizing it, which would make MUCH more sense in every other way.
In a way, I can't really say I blame them. While their AV is close to being the most expensive on the planet, I suspect that has a lot to do with all the regulatory hoops they have to jump through rather than profit (otherwise every other company would be looking to compete). They probably wouldn't have any incentive to make it if they could only sell 10% of what they do now...
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RE: NEAVB
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by Phobos on December 22, 2005
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Matt pretty much gave you the current situation. Protherics does not support domestic A/V banks for domestic snakes, they do think it's a good idea for exotic snakes. They go by Dr. Bushes "Time is Tissue" battle cry. They said treatment is faster if the hospital stocks CroFab rather than coming from a bank somewhere. I blew them out of the water by saying the lag in getting the A/V is not transporting it, it's convincing the Physicians they need to give it on a timely basis. I cited local bites where the Physicians in one case would not give A/V when it was needed, another case they would not give more than 5 vials when 21 was required to neutralize the bite because they did not want to take the risk of giving more. Several of us interceeded and had the victim transported to someplace that would use it. I told them they had a serious training issues left to take care of before I would buy their line of crap.
As Matt said, we are not supporting domestic bites with serum because CroFab cost too damn much. $1000/vial and an average of 18* used for moderate bites because it clears you system faster than the venom does. If we get 50 members at $300/person, that's about $15,000 for serum, which is not even enough $$ to buy enough CroFab to cover an "average bite". Till Bioclone is FDA approved for North American Crotalids we will not cover them with CroFab. Why not use Bioclone from the start, since it's a hands down better A/V and $200/ vial? Simply, it's NOT FDA approved drug, so if you were bitten and showed up with Bioclone A/V the Physicians would not in a million years give you the Bioclone when they have an FDA approved drug(CroFab)in the Pharmacy to use. Case closed, Till Bioclone is approved in about 3 years I would say.
When we get finished jumping throught the remaining FDA hoops we will stock plenty of serum for all the commonly kept exotics.
Cheers!
Al
* CroFab works the best on bites by the snake species used to make the A/V: A. piscivorus, C. atrox, C. adamanteus, and C. scutulatus. It is almost ineffective on Helleri bites where 30 or more vials may be needed. See the prescribing information for details.
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