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Need your expert advice again folks
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by Kenyalover on November 5, 2004
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I wrote you several years ago about my snake experiences while on safari in Kenya and you were good enough to give me some much needed advice.
A spitting cobra had been found in my tent bathroom on my first trip, last October a green mamba slithered up on the 3' high tent foundation to within 4' of where I was sitting, in February they had to kill a black mamba right below the tent foundation and in August I encountered a link-marked snake (poisonous but not deadly - just causes hemorrhaging) and another spitting cobra.
Because of my fear of these snakes but love for Tsavo East National Park and the tented camp where I stay, I will be heading back there again in February.
I have contacted a snake farm in the Malindi area. Supposedly the gentlemen is an expert with catching African snakes and milking them and making antivenin and getting it into the hands of natives who have been bitten. I am going to try to visit this place and get over some of my fear.
However, in his latest emails to me he states compression dressings should be used ONLY for MAMBAS and NON-SPITTING cobras in the African snake families. Does this sound correct to you experts?
To someone who is totally inexperienced it would seem that when you are 50 or miles away from any medical care that compression dressings should be used on any snake bite. (I would rather take a chance on losing one limb than my life).
I always take dressings with me and since I have continued to have close encounters I want to be sure to do the right thing if needed. Would appreciate any expert advice you can give.
Jan
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RE: Need your expert advice again folks
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by GREGLONGHURST on November 5, 2004
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There is one book out that does recommend compression bandage as first aid for all snakebite. I personally would hesitate to use one on anything other than an elapid bite. My reasoning is that viper venom causes swelling, & a compression bandage would in that case pretty much become a tourniquet. Use of a tourniquet more often than not leads to amputation.
~~Greg~~
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RE: Need your expert advice again folks
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by JRHarrison on November 6, 2004
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Compression bandage is for usage in neurotoxic bites only. Not for puff adders , rhino viper, gaboon viper, sawscaled viper(etc.) or spitting cobras.
Jim Harrison
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RE: Need your expert advice again folks
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by Kenyalover on November 6, 2004
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Greg and Jim:
Thanks so much for your reply. It pretty much echoes what this gentleman has told me and makes me now feel more confident.
Was also told by another person that with puff adder bites they treat it with epsom salts and distilled water. Hope to learn much more about these things when I get to the snake farm. Since I work in a hospital I am very interested in the medical and treatment aspects of bites also.
If any of you are interested in a snake catching safari you can look it up on www.magicalkenya.com or email Bio-Ken directly at snakes@africaonline.co.ke.
They have an extensive background handling African snakes.
Again, thanks so much for your help.
Jan
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RE: Need your expert advice again folks
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by Snakeman1982 on November 7, 2004
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If I am not mistaken Black mambas can also cause necrosis with their venoms. There are certainly elapids with hemotoxic venom as well (spitting cobras especially). I have seen some bad bite photos of both mambas and cobras that were necrotic. So putting a pressure bandage might not be the best thing. I personally doubt I would use one for a mamba or spitting cobra bite but there are others that have more experience with african snakes than me on this forum. They may recommend it.
Have you purchased "A field guide to the Reptiles of East Africa" by Stephen Spawls. It is $34 right now on Amazon.com and should contain everything you need to identify the snakes of the area and it will tell you what to do if bit by a snake.
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RE: Need your expert advice again folks
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by Snakeman1982 on November 7, 2004
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I just took a look at the East Africa book and it says that if the snake was a mamba or a non-spitting cobra, apply a pressure bandage (not tourniquet). Otherwise don't apply (meaning viper or spitting cobra).
There are a lot of local remedies. Epson salt and water wouldn't make sense. Venom is made up of multiple proteins and I doubt salt would denature them. Electrical shock was an interesting idea to use because it has theoretical potential to work but has been proven ineffective in most studies. Don't trust local remedies because many of them can do more harm than good. Even in Africa you are 95% or more likely to survive a bite from a venomous species (even without treatment), so be careful and get some good snake reading material.
Good luck and have fun in Africa
Robert
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RE: Need your expert advice again folks
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by Kenyalover on November 10, 2004
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Snakeman:
I don't personally have the book but they do have one at camp which I have studied.
You're right. There are a lot of "home remedies" out there. That is what is scarey. I had heard about the electrical shock treatment.
The thing that bothers me most is that we are at least 50 miles from the nearest anything (no 911, no ambulances, etc). Trying to drive fast over bumpy dirt roads, perhaps being blocked by a herd of elephants, after having been bitten by a venomous snake
would not be my idea of fun!
However, I'll learn all I can about bites and treatments and if I hear anything new and interesting I'll pass it along.
Thanks to all for your help.
Jan
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RE: Need your expert advice again folks
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by Snakeman1982 on November 10, 2004
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Hey Janet,
If you are only 50 miles away from the nearest hospital I wouldn't worry too much. It is highly unlikely that you'll get bit, especially if you walk the other way when you see one. But if you do get bit you should certainly have enough time to get to the hospital before you die. Very few people die from snake bites in the first few hours, even in Africa.
I am in the same boat with you. I'll be spending almost a month in the rainforests of Bolivia over winter break. I'll be with one other herpetologist and we'll both be hours away from any towns. Of course, we'll actually be looking for venomous snakes (along with other herps). But I am more worried about malaria, typhoid, and menegitis than snake bites. Make sure your shots are up to date and good luck.
Robert
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RE: Need your expert advice again folks
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by Rabies on November 10, 2004
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As all ready mentioned at the beginnig, pressure bandage and splinting is the cause of action for the majority of elapid bites in Africa (excluding spitting cobras)As in any bite remaining calm and avoiding as much movement as possible is basic management.I'd highly recomend a pressure bandage for any of the mambas, irrelavent how close/far the hospital is, especially for the black mamba. If you are unfortunate to take a bite or witness one do not waste time with local remadies.Have fun
John
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RE: Need your expert advice again folks
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by Kenyalover on November 12, 2004
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Robert:
If you're going to be in the rainforest you will indeed need to take precautions for malaria, typhoid, etc. I always travel to Kenya in the dry season. Always take antimalarial pills with me, but since I've never seen a mosquito I don't take them. Typhoid is always a possibility, but am staying in pretty high class tourist lodges and camps with delicious food prepared in as sanitary a method as possible in the bush.
Other than being a "snake magnet" my only other scarey incident was being charged by a Mama elephant and her two babies. Everyone was yelling at me to run and I didn't know what I was running from - it came from behind (yes,elephants can run very silently). When I was finally safe I asked my driver how close she was to me and I was told by several people she was two feet from my back!! Oh those adrenaline rushes huh!!
Just hope I learn enough at the snake farm to lose some of my fear of reptiles. At the tented camp I would love to sit on my veranda after dinner (it is elevated about 3 - 4 feet from the ground) to watch the elephants at the waterhole. However, because of snakes on the veranda in the past, I zip the tent and never go out after dark - just too dangerous. When lions or buffalo are outside your tent you know it. When snakes are there, you don't.
Hope you have a marvelous, safe and healthy trip.
Jan
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