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Gun deaths vs Venomous snake
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by Phobos on July 17, 2005
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Here's a bit of research done by Wes on another site. This could be an important tool in the fight with states that want to ban hots.
Posted by: W von Papineäu at Sat Jul 16 20:47:30 2005 [ Report Abuse ] [ Email Message ]
Dear Hot-philes;
The following is a follow-up to Brett’s kind invitation (I think its fair to say that... - lateralis, Jul 11, 2005) to muck about in my archives to find what is available on children being bitten/harmed/killed by ‘hot’s kept at home (as aside from incidents involving wild animals)
A press check back to 1994 did not give me much to work with, so I had to ‘hit the books; I consulted about 35 “serious” guns-and-children and venomous-bites sites for data … and pulled snippits from the ones I understand best. I’ll ask your trust that I don’t have a drum to beat here … I am both hot and gun friendly … though in no way experienced with the first.
Basically, there is NO press reports of any children being bitten by hots kept at home back to 1994. There are some python/boa/lizard bite events … but nothing involving hots.
A quick sweep of various guns-at-home-and-children sites and venom-treatment sites have resulted in a variety of interesting numbers. I’ve looted some numbers from various sites and jammed them together in paragraphs to illustrate the various points. Numbers flutuate a bit from year-to-year, but the trends are solid ... to wit ...
Gunfire killed 4,643 U.S. infants, children and teens in 1996, alarming figures, yet still the lowest American gun death toll since 1989. In 1998, 2,215 children and teenagers were murdered with guns, 1,241 committed suicide with guns, and 336 died in unintentional shootings. A total of 3,792 young people were killed by firearms. In 1999, there were 3,385 firearms-related deaths for children ages 0–19 years. They break down as follows: 214 unintentional, 1,078 suicides, 1,990 homicides, 83 for which the intent could not be determined, and 20 due to legal intervention.
Wes note for above ... so far, I have not found figures to break-down child-fatality-from-firearms to events that involved a firearm kept in the house, however, press involving shootings of children at home often mentioned that the family kept a gun at home.
In the US: Snakebites frequently go unreported. Approximately 4000-8000 bites are reported to national centers each year. The national average is approximately 4 bites per 100,000 persons.
Deaths secondary to snake bites are rare. The national average has been less than 4 deaths per year for the last several years.
Rattlesnake bites in children are rarely reported. Of the 8000 venomous bites that occur in the United States each year, half involve persons under the age of 20. The reported rate of fatalities occurring from envenomation is roughly 1 to 20 per year, with reports of 20% of deaths occurring in children under 5 years of age. Despite these statistics, envenomation in children is rarely reported in the medical literature.
{Wes note: The critical 'so what' here is that even though there are more venomous bites-per-year affecting all ages than there are child-deaths-from-guns ... medical reports and a distinct lack of press reporting back to 94, confirm that no children in America died from venomous bite from snakes (domestic or foreign) kept at home … unlike the gun numbers}
Ladies and Gentlemen, from where I type, there is no comparison in the ‘threat/danger’ provided to children by having a secured gun or a secured hot in the home …. Guns are historically proven a more significant danger by an overwhelming factor … based on the reported medical facts and lack of anti-hot press involving snakebites at home, the past risk of hots at home to children has been negligible.
respects
Wes (helmet on …)
Selected data from:
http://www.commondreams.org/pressreleases/Oct98/101298a.htm
http://www.bradycenter.org/stop2/facts/fs4.php
http://www.infoplease.com/ipa/A0922329.html
http://www.emedicine.com/med/topic2143.htm
http://www.wemjournal.org/wmsonline/?request=get-document&issn=1080-6032&volume=012&issue=03&page=0184
http://members.iinet.net.au/~bush/myth.html
1. There are three kinds of lies: lies, damned lies and statistics.
2. If enough data is collected, anything may be proven by statistical methods.
Thanks to: http://www.autobox.com/statjoke.html
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RE: Gun deaths vs Venomous snake
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by walterD on July 17, 2005
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We do have to take in account that there are 400 million people in the us and 2 thirds of those have atleast 1 gun in their home. That is almost along the lines of someone telling me that you stand far more risk dieing in a car than an airplane, but the last time I looked up to the sky i didn't see one car, but as I type in my office and look out the window, I see atleast 75 cars.
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RE: Gun deaths vs Venomous snake
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by fizzbob7 on July 17, 2005
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---We do have to take in account that there are 400 million people in the us and 2 thirds of those have atleast 1 gun in their home. That is almost along the lines of someone telling me that you stand far more risk dieing in a car than an airplane, but the last time I looked up to the sky i didn't see one car, but as I type in my office and look out the window, I see atleast 75 cars---
or you could look at it an intelligent way; there are far more venomous snakes in the united states than people who own guns or even guns at all for that matter.....venomous snakes are everywhere, always have been, and yet people still are more likely to be shot.....i've been shot at twice and had one put to my head once, i've also been stabbed on 4 occasions, all of that was more likely to kill me than the venomous snakes i keep....why? well, humans are dumbasses, and humans kill more humans each year than anything....humans with lung cancer sometimes cause that....humans with auto injuries usually cause that....STD's, yep, they cause that too......people are more dangerous to themselves than a whole collection of venomous reptiles ever could be
there are more hots than guns......
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RE: Gun deaths vs Venomous snake
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by Phobos on July 17, 2005
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Hey Walter...
How do you like them "tube socks"? That was one of the smaller Komodo I encountered while there...
Al
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RE: Gun deaths vs Venomous snake
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by agkistrodude on July 17, 2005
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And even more children die each year in swimming pools than by gunfire.Wheres the anti-pool crowd?Marty
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RE: Gun deaths vs Venomous snake
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by fizzbob7 on July 17, 2005
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---FIZZBOB, YOU HAVE ONLY BEEN BACK AT THIS FORUM FOR ONLY A MONTH OR SO AND YOU ARE STILL THE ARGUMENTATIVE PRICK THAT YOU HAVE ALWAYS BEEN........I CAN SEE WHY YOU HAVE HAVE HAD SO MANY PROBLEMS WITH GUNS OR KNIVES!---
is that you bill spencer? anyways, notice i never make anonymous posts....or incorrect posts....yes i'm argumentative because this is a forum, you either agree or disagree with people, not a whole lot of chit chat going on......and stupidity still abounds, just like everywhere.....you can always email at fizzbob7@charter.net to express your utter disappointment in my disposition.....i'm completely ok with that......
but the guy brought up the number of humans in american and the number of gun owners.....it was only fair to bring up the fact that there are more venomous SNAKES than personally owned guns (not counting the army, but even then, 1 of 3 war casualties are attributed to friendly fire or crashes)
that's a relevant point in my opinion....a very relevant point....according to the above mentioned stats, 8000 people are envenomated (only a handful or two die) and 5000 people DIE because of guns....so what's more dangerous? guns
ironically, my sister in law (16 years old) was just talking about how she had found her dad's handgun while he was working, took it out and pointed it at her boyfriend, then pretended to shoot her foot, etc....that's why there are 5000 deaths, because humans aren't responsible enough to have control over life....we're just never gonna be there yet as a whole
and by the way, i handled the "gun and knife" situations......i'm here and well, and have no problem being real, instead of just another fraud like a lot of people out there......
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RE: Gun deaths vs Venomous snake
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by agkistrodude on July 17, 2005
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Guns aren't dangerous at all until someone picks it up and pulls the triger.Venomous snakes are always dangerous.Marty
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