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RE: Baby gets salmonella from snake -UK
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by amanda34vry on March 30, 2008
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Hi, thankyou for your kind words with regards to chris-who surprisingly works as the manager of the pet shop where our snake was bought, how do i know this, he is the only idiot to mention pigs, and the doctors. I was going to return the snake back to the shop, in order for them to have the snake tested, but after obtaining legal advise, i will get the snake tested myself, which, yes, will cost around £100.00, but the satisfaction i will have by having it 100% conclusive, as i know it will be will be worth it.The public health lab, and the senior consultant who my daughter is under, have both stated it is 100% conclusive Pomona salmonella is very,very rare in this country and would/could only of been contracted from my snake,which now makes me wonder whether the snake was not captive bred but indeed shipped in from columbia or another foreign country. People have been mentioning hygiene, yes i know hygiene is paramount, its a pity the shop were not so concerned about hygiene and the way they allowed myself and children to handle 3 different snakes, on 2 seperate occasions(myself being heavily pregnant) and didn't advise us to wash our hands or use an antibacterial hand gel, if they had of, mybe they might of informed us of the potential risks, or i, myself would of queried why.
They say that everyone has a day in court well,maybe this will be mine, for the negligence that nearly cost my daughter her life, with Salmonella septicemia Pomona.
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RE: Baby gets salmonella from snake -UK
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by ChrisN on March 30, 2008
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Hhmm an idiot, well I have been called worse I’m sure. In fact my name is Chris Newman, hence ChrisN!
Current Positions
Chair – Federation of British Herpetologists (since 2001)
Chair – Federation of Companion Animal Societies (since 2004)
Associate member – Associated Parliamentary Group for Animal Welfare (since 2003)
Member – Sustainable Users Network (since 2000)
Member – Pet Care Trust, Livestock Advisory Panel (since 2000)
Member – Partnership for Action Against Wildlife Crime (since 2001)
Member – SSPCA Advisory Panel on Animal Health & Welfare (since 2006)
Member – Animal Network for Wales (since 2007)
Advisor – National Association of Private Animal Keepers (since 2001)
Consultant – Reptile & Exotic Pet Trade Association (since 2005)
Current Governmental Working Groups
Member – DEFRA Working Group on Non-Native Species
Member – DEFRA Working Group on CITES Article 8.2
Member – EIG Working Group on Companion Animals
Previous Governmental Working Groups
Chair - DEFRA Working Group on Pet Fairs (2003/2004)
Member – DEFRA Working Group on Pet Vending (2003/2004)
Member – DEFRA Working Group on Definition of Welfare (2004)
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RE: Baby gets salmonella from snake -UK
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by tigers9 on March 30, 2008
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Here is Chris Newman's presentation
http://www.rexano.org//ARandFutureofPetIndustryFrame.htm
Animal Rights & the
Future of the Pet Industry
<snip>
Animal keeping is not a privilege it is a right, as it is our right to be free.
Society can remove our rights, but only if we transgress the law.
We cannot afford to allow the AR industry to dictate the law or our rights
or in PDF:
http://www.rexano.org//OATOPresentation.pdf
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RE: Baby gets salmonella from snake -UK
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by amanda34vry on March 30, 2008
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My apologies Chris, its just coincidental that you'd pointed out the 2 matters Chris"the manager" of the pet shop had mentioned, and he was quite sarcastic and rude when i approached him and i presumed you were him,my mistake, again my apologies.
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RE: Baby gets salmonella from snake -UK
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by Cro on March 30, 2008
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Amanda and Chris, there is no need to start calling each other names here. I know you both have strong feelings on this issue. I will have to start deleting the posts though if the name calling continues.
Amanda, I think it is a very good idea for you to have a culture taken directly from the snake in question. If it tests positive for the specific Salmonella your daughter had, then you will have proven where your son might have picked up the bacteria and passed it on to your daughter, and you might have a case against the pet shop who sold the snake. However, I have to agree with your attorney, it is not your right to force the petshop to test the snake to defend itself, it is up to you to present your case and whatever evidence you need to go along with it. You are a concerned and angry mother, and there is nothing wrong with that, however, when you start making accusations to the news folks and using offhand comments by doctors, you are stepping over the line a bit, without having actual proof by cultures by an indendependant lab from the snake in question. Just knowing that reptiles carry that type of bacteria, and that you had a pet reptile does not provide enough proof from a legal stand point.
If the snake does not test positive, then perhaps your son picked up the bacteria somewhere else. Perhaps a neighbor keeps turtles ? Who knows, bacteria are everwhere, and could have even been dropped on your property by a bird flying over, or even a lizard in your yard.
As far as the hand cleaner thing, it is interesting. For many years, no one used antibiotic hand wipes of any sort when handling animals. And we all did not come down with Salmonella, so I guess the bacteria was not that much of a problem, and washing with soap and water was good enough. But I have noticed in the last year, that many reptile vendors at reptile shows are starting to have these alcahol hand wipe things, or little spray bottles on their tables. I have even had visitors to the shows ask me if I had these available, but since I do not sell live animals and only snake hooks, I really see no need for them. What is actually funny about this situation, is that the use of these products, especially the anti-bacterial hand soaps and sprays is causing a huge number of mutant bacteria forms to emerge, that are resistant to these chemicals. So, the fad of antibacterial hand cleaners is actually creating superbugs that will be far more dangerous than the original forms. From what I understand, isopropyl alcahol works just as well, and does not produce resistant bacterial forms.
Anyway, Amanda, after you get the lab work back from running a Salmanella culture on your pet snake, let us here know the results of the tests. I would much like to know if the pet snake actually carried the salmonella (rare but not unheard of), or if the snake was not the source. While you are at it, try doing testing on things like your countertops, wash wrags, sink, cutting boards, etc. Also, you might want to culture your son`s nasal cavities, as he might be an asymptomatic carrier of the bacteria. I am serious about that, he might have somehow picked up the bacteria, it has been known to happen. All it would take is handling a turtle with Salmonella somewhere, then his introducing the bacteria into his nose, where the damp warm enviornment could be a perfict breeding ground for it. There are humans who carry Leigonairs Disease and MRSA Staph in that same fashion. And it is often something they accidentally picked up, and has nothing to do with clenleness, just accidental contact with the bacteria and transfer of it to an enviornment where it can thrive.
Again, the main thing is that our daughter is well. That is by far the most important thing. And your wanting to warn others of potential dangers of pet reptiles is a good cause, but please back up your accusations with valid lab tests before your feed more information to the news and press.
Best Regards JohnZ
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