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RE: Rattlesnake Non-rattling Study
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by lanceheads on February 9, 2010
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Wolfgang,
I am sure you are aware, but over here on this side of the pond, grazing animals occur in every state. I think it was Klauber who floated this theory, but I think he was talking in general terms, not necessarily "plains". I think he mentioned cow's, bison, goat's, etc., as "grazers", I would have to find it in my library and check to make sure. However,"that" was a theory he had at the time.
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RE: Rattlesnake Non-rattling Study
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by Time on February 9, 2010
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When I am field herping, I have noticed that Crotalus atrox rarely rattle when flipping boards and tin that they may be hiding under. When I come across one that's on the move (whether in the brush or on the road)they almost always rattle.
When it comes to lepidus, I've found dozens over the years and only recall one that rattled as it crawled across the foot of a fellow herper! He didn't know the snake was there until it rattled!
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RE: Rattlesnake Non-rattling Study
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by Cro on February 9, 2010
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That is the nice thing about forums like this.
We can discuss all kinds of behaviors and beliefs about reptiles, and take a more modern look at some of the ideas of the past that might have been wrong.
Best Regards
John Z
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RE: Rattlesnake Non-rattling Study
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by pictigaster1 on February 9, 2010
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I have always wondered about the herd animal theory .As WW stated the mountains of mexico seem to be the birth place of the rattlesnake.Evolution seems to have many holes that are slowly filling as time passes.It is also very interesting how people have different experience from different species.Bushmasters and leps for instance.The fact that someones experience is different than someone elses does not mean they are wrong it just means it is different.It seems to me that there are many answers to this question not all wrong.
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RE: Rattlesnake Non-rattling Study
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by Irishviper on February 10, 2010
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I'll go back and look at some of my literature cited work. While klauber certainly mentioned grazers, he was not the first to point it out. I have a paper from the late 1800's that talked about it, but was later shot down. As to atrox rattling. This is one species that varies from geographic locality. The large ones I have encountered in south Texas where 50/50. The ones I see near Big Bend state park are nut jobs, and the ones I see out in southern California do not rattle unless disturbed. There is one noticable difference through out the range, they get smaller the further west you go. I have caught large males in southern Arizona, but nothing like the ones from Hidalgo and Cameron County in south Texas. The ones I see in Desert Center are very tiny. Much research is needed, and I suspect that size is not the only culprit. I think heat and humidity may be a factor as well. Alan
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RE: Rattlesnake Non-rattling Study
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by CAISSACA on February 10, 2010
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Randal,
I am well aware of grazing animals being everywhere - but the same is true in much of the world. I suspect that the plains inspired the "adaptation to repel large grazers" idea simply because to us, they look so devoid of shelter. In reality, I rather doubt that being trampled to death ever was a major factor for many snakes - presumably the plains, just as any other habitat, just look exposed and devoid of cover to us, but are actually full of rodent burrows, and the snakes are rarely all that far from them, and thus unlikely to get caught out.
Just my $ .02
Cheers,
WW
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RE: Rattlesnake Non-rattling Study
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by Irishviper on February 10, 2010
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As far as my research goes, there are no grazers, not in the sense that one would see out on the plains. True, you do have Elk, Bighorn, and either White Tail or Mule Deer, but not in numbers that would bother a snake. Not to mention that all of the montain rattlers I work with are in really rough rocky terrain that most cervids would go around. Not much to eat in a talus slope. Now back to the grazer issue. This part of Texas has lots of cattle ranches, but I have never seen atrox, scutulatus, molossus, or viridis ever disturbed by a cow. What I do see however is Javelina, and ferrel hogs attempting to eat them, if they are small enough. At that point rattling as a warning would be a bad thing. Alan
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RE: Rattlesnake Non-rattling Study
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by Irishviper on February 11, 2010
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I left the Prong Horn out to the huge number decline. As recent as 20 years ago, it was still possible to see a herd of 200 or better around Van Horn. Not today, I rarely see more than a group of five or six at most.
Alan
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