Records - Experts Forum at VenomousReptiles.org

Records	Reply
by agkistrodude on March 14, 2011	Mail this to a friend!
I've often wondered where the length "records" come from in a lot of reptile publications. There have been many times that I've read about a species that states the average length, and then the record length. I've personally caught/kept snakes that were over these so-called "records" over the years. And I just happened to think about it again while looking through the "Peterson Field guides Reptiles and Amphibians" and was reading about the Bluestripe Garter Snake with a record length of 39 1/4 inches. I thought dang, mine has to be close to that, so I measured her. So where do these records come from? Who determines them? Is it the longest one pickled in a jar somewhere? Or is it the longest the author has seen? Who is the "official measurer"? Or is it something agreed upon by a group of herpetologists? Just wondering. Take care, Marty

RE: Records	Reply
by BobH on March 14, 2011	Mail this to a friend!
In my opinion they are the longest ones that have been recorded from the field or from preserved specimens. I am not sure how ones that have been in captivity fit in to record sizes. There is actually a section in Herpetological Review that publishes records on a variety of topics such as unusual foods, behaviors,size, etc. They would certainly make the call on the captivity question. If I were you, I would go for it, they would probably need fairly precise locality information to make sure it is the correct subspecies. If you need any assistance with it, I would be glad to help. Bob

RE: Records	Reply
by agkistrodude on March 14, 2011	Mail this to a friend!
I wasn't looking to get into any record books. I was just always curious as to where those records came from, and how accurate they were. I new it couldn't be just from someone who "once saw one that stretched across a two lane hwy" like we've all heard at one time or another. I figured it would probably be from a preserved specimen somewhere. And a captive specimen probably wouldn't count anyways. But I've caught a couple over the years, for example, many years ago I caught a Chicago Garter Snake that beat every record I could find back then in the local libraries by 3 1/2 inches. But thanks for the info! Take care, Marty

RE: Records	Reply
by Cro on March 14, 2011	Mail this to a friend!
Over the years, I have found tons of animals that would have been range extensions, as well as a number of animals that were longer than the "record" size. I probably should have sent in more of them to Herp Review, however, it takes some effort to write up things, and send them in, and, it is not always easy to scrape up a road killed animal and preserve it. The reporting system is a bit biased against field herping folks with legitimate finds who are individuals. A good example of this can be found in the Georgia Herp Atlas that came out a few years back. While it is a fairly good publication, it leaves hundreds of animals out of counties where they are found, simply because there was not a preserved voucher specimen floating around in a pickle jar for the folks who wrote the book to look at. I do not believe in killing and pickling animals simply to prove they are found in a different county of a state. Things like photographic proof of an animals identity should be proof enough. The two main road killed animals that I wish I had scraped up from the road and preserved, and sent into Herp Review, are a dusky pygmy rattlesnake, and a Florida cottonmouth, both of which were far larger than the current records. Best Regards John Z

RE: Records	Reply
by Crash1265 on March 15, 2011	Mail this to a friend!
If you find something that you would like to publish a record of you can also go to http://www.naherp.com/ It is a on-line data base that is used for studies and research.

RE: Records	Reply
by agkistrodude on March 15, 2011	Mail this to a friend!
Yeah John, I too have found a few that would be range extensions. I usually tell folks that those range maps are close approximations, and that there isn't a snake in the world that can read one! Take care, Marty

RE: Records	Reply
by snakeguy101 on March 27, 2011	Mail this to a friend!
I think a majority of the records come from zoos and research expeditions. If the private sector was included I think we would have much more accurate records of ranges and sizes.

RE: Records	Reply
by stacyg on March 28, 2011	Mail this to a friend!
What is record water moccasin? My daughters boyfriend killed 7ft 7 inch. Never seen a snake like this before. Would not have believed it. When told it was 8ft I took tape measure with me. Figured I'd see 4 or 5 ft. Measured it myself. Been dead 4 or 5 days but still intack.

RE: Records	Reply
by lanceheads on March 28, 2011	Mail this to a friend!
I would like to see a picture of that. Do you have one?

RE: Records	Reply
by Time on March 28, 2011	Mail this to a friend!
What species of Water Moccasin? The record for the Western Cottonmouth is just over 5ft with the average 2-3 ft. Like Randal, I would like to see a pic. Diamondback and Brown Watersnakes are typically longer than the Cottonmouth and 8ft is still extreme.

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