|
1-10 of 31 messages
|
Page 1 of 4
Next
|
|
Should I Gets my 12 Year Old a Hot ?
|
Reply
|
|
by kaouthiaking on March 16, 2011
|
Mail this to a friend!
|
|
Hey guys, I have been keeping hots since I'm 10. Now my 12 year old wants a hot and I figured it would be a little hypercritical to tell him no. My 16 year old has a gaboon viper and handles it very well. He knows how to use all his tools and he is very professional about it. Because it's my son I am a little bit more uptight about it then I would usually be. I for one am not very sensitive about snakes and don't feel that keeping hots is a very big deal. I think it's more hype then anything. Usually when a person comes over my house and sees my hot snakes they always act the same way. First they get dramatic, then they act like they are shocked, and then about a minute later they forget about it and act like it's normal. Occasionally I even take one out on a hook and show them that the animal is completely harmless and that only idiots get bit. But since it's my son I'm a little more worried. I don't want to start him off with a non hot because I don't want him to be to comfortable. If I get him one I want to just through him right in there so he can learn the right way. I was thinking about maybe starting him off with something like a temple viper which isn't that toxic and has a good temperament. I had a pet rattler growing up so I think he should be ok. What do you think ?
|
| |
|
RE: Should I Gets my 12 Year Old a Hot ?
|
Reply
|
|
by Crotalusssp on March 16, 2011
|
Mail this to a friend!
|
These are your children and the question is one you will need to answer for yourself in the end. My immediate thought is, "Why a venomous snake, and not a non-venomous?".
I personally do not like the idea, but as I said it will be your decision in the end.
Please be careful.<--This statement is for everyone, everywhere, in any way involved in this hobby.
Charles
|
| |
|
RE: Should I Gets my 12 Year Old a Hot ?
|
Reply
|
|
by HerpHunter63 on March 16, 2011
|
Mail this to a friend!
|
Common sense would tell you how dangerous that could be. Also, I disagree with your opinion on keeping the non-venomous snakes. Most herpetologists, including some of the best in the world grew up keeping non-venomous snakes and handle the most dangerous snakes known to man on a regular basis. Not only did it help define their skills it enabled them to practice them too. I, for one would much rather be bitten by a rat snake than a mamba or cobra or whatever, but what im trying to say is that you can make a mistake with a rat snake and get away with it but with hots you cant. Plus, I feel that your claim of getiing him a snake whose venom is "not that bad" is absolutely rediculous. Maybe your haven't heard but a guy died quite recently from a copperhead bite (which has a weak venom) however, just because a snake dosent kill everyone it bites dosent mean it can kill at all. There is always that element of danger involved and those who cant accept that are an accident ready to happen.
I suggest you rethink your plans otherwise it could leave you in alot of trouble...
|
| |
|
RE: Should I Gets my 12 Year Old a Hot ?
|
Reply
|
|
by HerpHunter63 on March 16, 2011
|
Mail this to a friend!
|
Hmm, I had a look over your profile after making the above post and I may have gotten the wrong end of the stick. I was imagining you to be some random hillbilly that kept a couple rattlers in your teens (no offense to you at all)but i'm clearly wrong. I owe you an apology, it seems your an expirienced keeper and know your stuff. Im sorry I came off a little bit strong but, with all the dumbasses trying to invade the hobby at the moment, I tend to keep my guard up. It is your choice in the end but please take my other points above into consideration.
Thanks,
Andy
|
| |
|
RE: Should I Gets my 12 Year Old a Hot ?
|
Reply
|
|
by earthguy on March 16, 2011
|
Mail this to a friend!
|
I'll second Charles that it is your child, but you came asking for opinions, so here they are:
It is NOT hypocritical of you to keep hots and not let your kid have one...yet. He is your child, and you're responsible for him still. There are many things that I do that I wouldn't let my kids do...yet. They just don't have the life experience of the fully developed frontal lobe to make good decisions yet. Quite often the most important, most overlooked (and most often difficult) part of being a parent is telling your kids no. You want them to be happy, but your job is to raise them right and keep them safe.
My daughter wanted a much more dangerous animal - a horse. I told her no for many years. I finally let her have one AFTER the had worked with another horse and rider for a number of years. Even now with as much experience as she has I make sure I'm somewhere near the pasture when she works her horse, just in case. You may try a similar approach with your kid & hots. Several years of SAFE apprenticeship and you can have a hot, but you have to come to me to get the keys.
|
| |
|
RE: Should I Gets my 12 Year Old a Hot ?
|
Reply
|
|
by Cro on March 16, 2011
|
Mail this to a friend!
|
Frank, there are many factors that will come into play here.
First off, would be the level of responsibility, attention to details, and maturity of your 12 year old.
Second would be your willingness to Mentor your son. Your statement that keeping venomous snakes is not a big deal is a common one for experienced keepers, however, it should not be for a 12 year old. If you mentor your son, you should make it a very big deal, as a cage left unlocked just once, or, a mistake like reaching into a cage for a water bowl, etc, can lead to tragic consequences.
Third, would be the availability of antivenin if a bite were to happen. You mention temple vipers, which will require antivenin to be brought in from a zoo, if your son or someone else is bitten. It would be much better to start with a small North American pit viper, as the CroFab antivenin is much more readily available at many hospitals.
Fourth, would be the correct housing of the snake in a locked cage, that is totally escape proof, and perhaps your control of the lock, or, at least strict rules that the cage not be opened unless you are there. I would suggest a year long "trial" period of mentoring, where you follow a rule like that until you see just how well your son does.
Fifth, you must consider what might happen if your son, or someone else were bitten, or, the snake got loose and was not found. That could involve defax / children's services taking a look at your suitability as a parent, depending on how they are in your area.
Sixth, is perception and responsibility to the reptile keeping hobby as a whole. If your son makes a mistake, it could be one more nail in the coffin of venomous reptile keeping in PA as a whole. There are recent efforts to shut down the Hamburg / Berks shows, and we do not need more venomous reptile keepers making the news.
Anyway, as far as being hypocritical, I was keeping venomous snakes at age 12. Some folks are ready at that age, but, many are not. I have known 14 year olds who kept exotic venomous snakes, and were probably more competent than many adults are at keeping venomous snakes. They were the exceptions though. Many kids should not be keeping venomous snakes, as they are just not ready.
Ultimately, you as a parent will have to decide what is right for you son. Make your decision carefully.
Also, due to the nature of this thread, I will be keeping a close eye on it as a site administrator, as a topic like this can often get out of hand, so, I will remind folks that we need to keep this thread civil, and avoid name calling, etc. Any violation of that will be deleted.
Best Regards
John Z
|
| |
|
RE: Should I Gets my 12 Year Old a Hot ?
|
Reply
|
|
by Rob_Carmichael on March 16, 2011
|
Mail this to a friend!
|
|
This thread scares the heck out of me. Laissez faire attitudes, letting a child keep hots, no apparent emergency plans, etc, etc. It doesn't surprise me why state after state is putting the clamps on our hobby. Yup, lets make this public so that we can just continue to add fuel to the fire as to why our hobby should be illegal to the many organizations who catalogue these types of things. Can't blame the nay-sayers.
|
| |
|
RE: Should I Gets my 12 Year Old a Hot ?
|
Reply
|
|
by kaouthiaking on March 16, 2011
|
Mail this to a friend!
|
While some of the comments here touch base on the areas I am concerned with others aren't really what I was expecting to see. I would like to address some of these people. First, HerpHunter63, you do not treat a non venomous snake the same way you treat a venomous snake. Thus, it would be pointless start my son with a non venomous snake. If he is going to get into herpetology I think it is more effective to train him from a top down approach, rather than from a bottom up. He will learn how to deal with the most volatile reptiles first and then work his way down to a corn snake. I think this will instill a greater level of confidence and certainty in him which he will need in the future. This also makes sense since he already has his eye on a hot he wants, and he worked and saved his money to get it. It would be completely irresponsible to give him any non venomous snake, and then get him a venomous, and have him believe he is ready for it. That would be some kind of cruel joke that you can go play on your own kids. I can't even think of a single instance where I treated my most aggressive non venomous snake the same way that I would treat my least toxic hot. Which leads to my next point. The only thing that is "absolutely ridiculous" about my claim regarding the level of toxicity is your response. First, I stated that I was thinking about getting him a snake that is only slightly toxic like a temple viper. Temple vipers have bit countless people, including children, and have never killed anyone or caused a serious injury. They are also known to have good tempers. You compared that to a copperhead which are known to kill people. So that is kind of a straw man argument. Garter snakes are venomous too, would but would you really care if it bit you and injected venom in you with its rear fangs ? Probably not, now compare that to something like a mamba, which has killed countless people, and is extremely aggressive, and I am sure you will see my point. What would you rather get bit by ? P.S. My friend was bit by Atheris Hispida not too long ago and absolutely nothing happened his hand swelled a little and that was it so toxicity level is a valid concern. Third, I don't care how you say it, don't ever call me a hillbilly or else I will break your face. It is easy to be an online tuff guy but I wonder if you would try to be that insulting or sleazy to my face while I ask serious questions regarding my kids. Snakes I can tolerate, insults are another story, and again, I don't care how you say it you still said it. Would you like it if I said, "oh, I am sorry , I thought you were just a stupid fagot but I must have been mistaken, sorry" no, you wouldn't, because at the end of the day it was still said and still makes you look bad. Right ?
I appreciate earthguys and Cro's comments, however I might not have been very clear regarding a few things. I purchase a bite protocol for every hot I keep. I also would certainly be training and supervising my son for the first year at least, several seems a bit extreme. I wouldn't just get him the snake and expect him to be completely responsible for it. Also, he has worked with me and my hots, and will be trained more thoroughly if we get the snake, but thanks for your input Cro I really appreciate it.
Lastly I would like to address Rob_Carmichael. First, I never said I didn't have emergency plans, in fact I do, nor was that an issue, another straw man argument, Next, Keeping venomous snakes shouldn't be illegal anywhere, Keeping venomous snakes is my liberty, it makes me happy, and they are my property. Stupid bureaucrats and know nothing liberal interest groups who have never kept a snake a day in their lives are not going to affect the way I live my life. The only reason why are snakes are getting banned is because the reptile community didn't start fighting for its interest until recently. Children are very capable of keeping hots if they are taught correctly. The reason why I posted this thread was to see if anyone else had kids keeping hots who may have some good pointers or advice. Not to listen to cowardice rambling which is completely off topic. If you want to make an issue out of this you can go and start another thread, that goes for other topic comments as well.
|
| |
|
Email Subscription
You are not subscribed to this topic.
Subscribe!
My Subscriptions
Subscriptions Help
Check our help page for help using
, or send questions, comments, or suggestions to the
Manager.
|
