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Potency after continued milking
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by bannon88 on December 18, 2001
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I'm new to this page, and have a few questions I hope some one can answer for me.
I'm interested in whether anyone knows how repeated milking of snakes affects the potency?
Is there an amount of time before the venom is reproduced?
What is considered a normal milking interval?
How much variability is there between potency of snake of the same species?
Can anyone confirm whether high potency levels are passed on through control bredding programs?
I ask these questions because i am heading up a research program into using the extracted and purified protein contortrostatin (CN) found in the copperhead's venom. The hope is to use CN to delay and retard the growth rate of tumors in women with breast cancer. Any help with these questions is greatly appreciated
Thanks
Brian
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RE: Potency after continued milking
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by filthy on December 20, 2001
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Hi Bannon,
This is a big one that I'm not really qualified to answer. I'll put out a shout for some folks who are.
luck,
f
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RE: Potency after continued milking
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by BGF on December 20, 2001
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In response to your question, the biggest influence in change of profile of the venom would be from damage done through manual 'helping' of the venom release ie... squeezing on the venom glands. If the snake is left to its own devices, there will be minimal damage done during the milking. The overall health of the snake of course will influence matters.
Variations within a species is quite considerable. Contortrostatin for example was purified from Agkistrodon contortrix contortrix. There is no gaurantee that it will be in other subspecies or even a different population of the same species. That said, disintegrins are ubiquitous in viper venoms..
What Uni are you doiing this work at?
Cheers
BGF
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RE: Potency after continued milking
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by TIMFRIEDE on December 20, 2001
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Just a couple extra things to add to BGF's post. 2-3 weeks is a good time frame for milking, that's what I use. I let the snake bite and I do not force venom out. I remember reading a Toxicon article some time back regarding a change in daltons with N pallida, with each spat. I think about 10 or so was takin with the first spat and then it changed with other spats. A certain ssp can have a different venom comp, ie durissus, scutes and I guess some hajes. Heck, I just found out out from Bryan that Dj has a PLA2 fraction, enzymes in the Dendro complex, so cool B. I can't wait to tell Harold, that's what he uses for SI. B, have you found any nic. alphas with angusticeps? Did you get my e-mail? Tim
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RE: Potency after continued milking
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by bannon88 on December 21, 2001
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I work for a pharmacuetical firm, and we are taking over development of some previous research being done by the firm we acquired.
I'm going to a snake breeding facility in South Carolina, and was just curious as to some of the techniquies used in the collection process. I'm trying to get an idea of what to look for and how different techniques could adversly affect the potency of the collected venom.
Thank for your info so far.
Brian
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RE: Potency after continued milking
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by BGF on December 22, 2001
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Considering that the subunits of contortrostatin are only ~ 6 kDa why don't you just synthesise or express it?
Cheers
BGF
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RE: Potency after continued milking
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by BGF on December 22, 2001
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Hi Tim,
The purified short chains to date (SWISS-PROT accession numbers are in the parenthesis) are Dendroaspis jamesoni (P01417), Dendroaspis polylepis (P01416) and Dendroaspis viridis (P01418). The purified long chains are Dendroaspis polylepis (P01394, P25667, P01397 and P01396), Dendroaspis viridis (P01395), Dendroaspis jamesoni (P01393).
As for the PLA2s, I'm not going to have time to do any work on them. However, a Swiss group is looking at the various Dendroaspis populations and no doubt they'll characterise them. I'm too busy with Boiga and Boomslang venom now-a-days to do anything else ;-)
Cheers
B
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RE: Potency after continued milking
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by Naja_oxiana on December 24, 2001
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High Brian,
As you've already heard from some of the best on the subject, I cannot add much, except to reiterate that frequent milking can denigrate the health of the snake, and that two week intervals between milkings is--from what I've read--a good healthy recouperation time.
Cheers
Roger
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