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RE: Anyone see reptile kings search for the lost v
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by Snakeman1982 on March 13, 2005
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You guys have got to watch out for who you insult. Dr. Lee Grismer is very well respected in the "academic" herp community. Many of his methods may not seem great on tv but a lot of that is how research is done. Extracting a half eaten frog is very important to the scientific community, happens in many research studies. Every little bit gives us more insight into the lives of the animals we study.
I disagree with bringing 3 teenagers with what seemed to be little or no biological field experience but you can't insult him as a scientist. Look his name up a bit more, especially some of his "Baja California" work. If you read more herpetology books you would know his name!!!
I didn't like some of the unprofessionalism in the video as far as making the video for the general public but he is still a good biologist. I think many academics may look slightly down on him for bringing three teenagers along for a "camping trip" when it should be a scientific study but maybe not. And I also don't like the fact that he just claimed that it was a new species without really researching it for why it is a new species. I don't think anyone actually learned how to go about defining a new species. It made it sound like if you find a snake that acts a certain way and is skinnier than you thought, then you obviously have a new species. That didn't even tell people the genus of the new species or anything "Trimeresurus". But I did like how they put the scientific names on the other species they found. You don't see that very often on tv.
All and all I liked the show. It wasn't as professional as I would have liked but it is about the best thing I have seen on Animal Planet in about 3 years or more. Atleast their facts were correct.
Again, be careful who you publicly insult if you want to make a career in academia. Your words "and opinions" can come back to haunt you later in your career. Dr. Grismer is very well respected and his son may end up being that way as well.
btw, the species of green snake was an Asian vine snake (Ahaetulla mycterizans) common name Malayan Green whipsnake.
Robert
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RE: Anyone see reptile kings search for the lost v
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by FLVenom911 on March 13, 2005
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I just finished watching snake kings. I enjoyed it alot. It reminded me of how we were going nuts on everything we caught in Costa Rica. Seemed like a bunch of good dudes out herpin and having fun.
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RE: Anyone see reptile kings search for the lost v
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by Snakeman1982 on March 13, 2005
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Also, if you watch the show you will notice that Dr. Grismer is properly identifying all these rare species of herps they are finding. He isn't out there identifying king cobras, burmese pythons, green anacondas, etc... like everyone else does. Or herps native to the U.S. that any idiot can identify. These are species not well studied and not known except to real biologists who specialize in that area of the world. There are few field guides to herps in regions of South America and Asia. You can't just carry around a book to help you identify everything. Biologists that study in those areas know their herps forwards and backwards. You have to spend years reading papers, traveling, and looking at specimens to know these species that few have heard of. And Grismer knows them well. Soon his son probably will also.
I don't know how inexperienced the other three guys were but they might not have been that inexperienced as well. I am just assuming they were amatures. They did seem to brag about themselves a bit but then again, they seemed to be able to back it up as well.
I would like to see your Austin Stevens identify some of those Asian herps, lol!!! Actually, I would like to see him identify a not-so-common African herp where he is from. Since he is a published herpetologist and everything. Even though no one has seen any of his publications, photographs, etc...
Robert
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RE: Anyone see reptile kings search for the lost v
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by wcoley on March 14, 2005
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I watched the show and they used a technique that I have yet to be exposed to. The were using long blow pipes to get some of the herps out of tall trees. Anyone else had any experience with this? If so, how did it go?
Thanks,
Will
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RE: Anyone see reptile kings search for the lost v
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by TurtleDude on March 14, 2005
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I agree with Robert too.
If anyone is interested in a DVD copy of the "Search for the Lost Viper", let me know via e-mail. I can't legally sell them due to copyright laws, so there'd just be a small shipping and handling fee. E-mail me directly at brotherloggerhead@hotmail.com I'll also include MSNBC Andventurer's Cobra and Sea Snake episode on the same disc. Probably walking the fine line of copyright infringement by distributing copies, but I think they were great shows and some of you serious herpers might like to add them to your libraries. (For home use only, of course!)
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RE: Anyone see reptile kings search for the lost v
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by Snakeman1982 on March 14, 2005
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The blow pipes were very interesting. I have seen many herpetologists use rubber bands, noses, etc... but never blow pipes. Noses are very useful but I laughed at my herpetology professor 5 years ago when he showed me the large rubber bands he was going to use to catch lizards. I thought he was joking but later I would come to find that this is a common and even published technique.
I know in the tropics there are a lot of lizards that are just too quick to catch. A blow pipe for stunning the lizard may be an excellent method for me to experiment with the next time I am in South America.
Robert
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RE: Anyone see reptile kings search for the lost v
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by MoccasinMan on March 14, 2005
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I saw the show and thought it was exellent. The good Dr. is a one of the worlds leading Herpetologists. Learn from him instead of judging him. Why are so many so quick to be critical? Listen to Snakeman1982 he covered the salient facts. Live and learn!
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RE: Anyone see reptile kings search for the lost v
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by ochild on March 23, 2005
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Wow, ‘expert’s forum’ could not possibly be more of a misnomer. To claim to know anything about herpetology and be oblivious to Lee and Jesse Grismer is laughable. Perhaps some of you ‘experts’ should stop reading the online guides to reptile husbandry and pick up a scientific journal or textbook. Dr. Lee Grismer is a renowned scientist who has described dozens of species and has contributed prodigiously to the biological knowledge of organisms. His son Jesse has been publishing in peer-reviewed scientific journals since he was 14. The ‘amateurs’ with them were scientists that are members of Dr. Lee Grismer’s lab.
What you witnessed by viewing “Reptile Kings” was a team of scientists collecting real scientific data. You may have seen techniques with which you are unfamiliar, because they are the techniques used by scientists in the field, not by dilettantes whom are out to prove they do not have excessively small intermittent organs by handling dangerous reptiles.
I also find it quite jocular how some of you consider spending months backpacking the Malaysian wilderness as a casual ‘camping trip’. These guys were not flown in by animal planet for a couple of days to catch some pre-planted reptiles under some logs and then head home before contracting Plasmodium falciparum. This is the actual fieldwork that these scientists must perform to obtain valuable data, and diseases such as malaria are the onus they have paid.
This does not apply to everyone posting on this forum, for some of you seem quite earnest. However, many of you are the absolute quintessence of why those of us that are actually real scientists who happen to study reptilian model systems often are not taken seriously by the general public. You are the bane of herpetology.
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