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Certain pictures in certain classifieds
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by Chance on April 5, 2005
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This issue has been brought up on the Kingsnake forums before, but I don't think I've seen it here recently. In light off all the new laws being created almost daily in various parts of the country, I find it odd that certain "well-respected" members of the hot keeping community find it necessary to post ads of themselves freehandling deadly venomous snakes. Is it really necessary? Or is it a macho, "look what I can do" sort of thing? I'm betting on the latter. The worst part about it is I don't see much of anyone saying a dang thing about it! These ads are more dangerous to the venomous hobby than any venomoid could ever be...well, any real venomoids that is. If some idiot buys a snake from these people posting the ads, and thinks "well he can get away with it, why can't I?" then gets nailed, that is one more proverbial nail in the coffin of this community. I've said it before and I'll say it again, I'm glad I got out when I did. With all the internal bickering amongst each other, AV issues, and bite stories hitting the spotlight seemingly weekly now, rather than slowing the pace of new legislation, the people in this hobby have bumped it up another 10 notches! Enjoy it while you can folks.
-Chance
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RE: Certain pictures in certain classifieds
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Anonymous post on April 5, 2005
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Everyone says what you are saying but it is all bullshit. Nobodys going to buy a snake and free handle it just because someone else did. I think you are talkig about the king cobra. Nobody is going to pay a few thousand dollars just to freehandle a king cobra. The laws arent passed because the lawmakers see these websites. The laws are passed because they have no reason to let us carry on.
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RE: Certain pictures in certain classifieds
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Anonymous post on April 5, 2005
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The hobby aint gonna dissappear. People are such alarmist. States are regulating it more now because there was NO CURRENT REGULATIONS in place at the time. It's easier to change something that wasnt there rather if a current law is already being held. Chance, do you actually think Legislators look at our venomous classifieds??? Com on man I doubt they have that much time on their hands. If someone has an old school way of doing things, why do people bash it, just because it doesnt jive with what they do.
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RE: Certain pictures in certain classifieds
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by bush_viper17 on April 5, 2005
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Im not going anywhere. I personally think some laws should be more inforced. I honestly think that the massive importation and cheap prices of highly dangerous snakes like egyptian cobras should stop. No average person "deserves" something like that. I think Georgia should protect our beautiful native venomous snakes. Do I think that each individual can say what they are capable of and keep what they want? Yes...But do I think that laws should be passed to keep highly dangerous animals out of the lay persons hands? Definetly. Not keep make the snakes unavailable, but there needs to be better permitting systems. I know people that live in Georgia that are very capable of safely keeping these animals but our laws are so screwed up that we cant keep them. I know some people in other states that arent qualified to keep dangerous animals ,but there laws make it easy for them to get them. I think all states should have dangerous animal permitting systems. Florida seems to be the best state permit wise. I wish more states were like Florida.
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RE: Certain pictures in certain classifieds
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by Chance on April 5, 2005
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Oh you're completely right, the lawmakers don't look at the venomous classifieds (though I wouldn't be so quick to say wildlife officers don't, but that's a whole other issue). Of course though, that doesn't have a shred of anything to do with what I posted. My entire point was the example these people are setting. And no, I'm not talking about a king cobra ad. If I see some keeper I highly admire freehandling, say, a baby monocled cobra, then one day down the road I may decide to give it a shot myself. I, on the other hand, may not be quite so lucky, and may get those tiny little fangs embedded into my hand. Then off to the hospital I go. The press gets wind of yet another private keeper who has a COBRA in his house and bam, there goes the venomous keeping in my state. This is what I'm referring to, not that legislators spend a second perusing the classifieds, but that some idiot will do what his role model does and get nailed. This is probably all a moot point anyway, because states are probably now picking up momentum on passing new animal laws from other states, not from people within their state. Even here in Arkansas, where we haven't had a report of a private keeper getting bitten since I can remember, they're about to pass a law highly regulating the keeping of large carnivores. Snakes aren't far behind. In the end, I personally hope all states require permits for any dangerous animal, but an all out ban is just so much easier to deal with isn't it?
-Chance
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RE: Certain pictures in certain classifieds
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by Phobos on April 5, 2005
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Gee Chance...I see you kicked a fire ant nest...see the anonymous slime running around biting whomever is messing up their perfect world. How dare you bring something as scary as REALITY into this forum.
The sad thing is real fire ants have more of a clue what's going on that most of the anonymous poster.
By the way guys, Chance is 100% right..It's the end of days as far as private ownership of Hot herps...Watch the states fall one by one. Soon the dealers will have very few customer in very few states.
If your not part of the solution you're part of the problem!
Cheers!
Diamond Butt Al
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RE: Certain pictures in certain classifieds
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by Buzztail1 on April 5, 2005
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1. I have been removing ads that show freehandling and letting the people replace the ad without the picture. Freehandling ads also tend to give the wrong impression to anyone who might otherwise be interested in the snakes for sale.
2. I would rather every post not turn into an end of days for venomous keepers thread. It is certainly hard times for venomous keepers and anyone in a state that doesn't already have laws had better get involved in developing a permit system through accessible politicians. But not every state will fall. Georgia, and Florida aren't changing any time soon. Florida will fight the loss of revenue that is generated by permits.
Let's keep all of those "the world as we know it is ending" posts in the appropriate "the world as we know it is ending" threads. I don't totally disagree but I don't want it to color every thread.
Karl
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RE: Certain pictures in certain classifieds
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by Cro on April 5, 2005
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Jeremy: You mention the Florida Wildlife Law as being the best in the country. What do others here think about the Florida Law? Is it fair? Could it be improved? Has anyone sent the Florida Law to the NC Legislators as a suggestion on how they should structure their law? Best Regards JohnZ
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RE: Certain pictures in certain classifieds
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by FLVenom911 on April 5, 2005
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John,
I think Florida has the best permit system in the US. It is very fair and many people dont complain about it. FWC backs us and even when they catch unlicensed people, they simply confiscate the animals and give them to other licensed individuals or zoos. It doesnt make wide spread media panic and such as compared to some other states where it would be the main headline on that evening news. As Karl said, it will not be changing anytime soon. If venomous was banned here, then Miami Intl airport would loose out because all the exotic shipments come in through Miami. I to dont see that happening. But to other hot keepers in states that aren't regulated, please lobby with fellow herpers to get some type of permit system in place.
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RE: Certain pictures in certain classifieds
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by Buzztail1 on April 5, 2005
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John, I like the Florida permitting system. I, like so many others, was shocked when it jumped from $5 a year to $100 a year but in retrospect that still isn't very expensive overall. Is it fair? Compared to Georgia's "permitting system" it is wonderful! Fair is a relative term. I think that it is fair (at least to me). I maintain a Florida permit even though I live in Georgia. Could it be improved? I am not sure. Perhaps it should be expanded to include large constrictors such as the Burmese Pythons which have been showing up in the Everglades. I have not sent it to NC legislators but that might not be a bad idea. Show the legislators a way for the state to make money for F & G (DNR or whatever it is in NC) and still create legislation? They should love that! It is a win win for the legislators.
Karl
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