VenomousReptiles.org Survey

Survey Question	Current Survey Question Should hobbyists ever free handle venomous reptiles with their hands? Recent Surveys Most venomous/toxic Naja species in the world? I have read that the Philippine cobra is the most venomous (mice, 0.2 mg/kg SC with the lowest reported value being 0.14 mg/kg SC) (Brown, 1973). I have recently, come across something in the Indian Journal of Experimental Biology (Vol. 30, (issue 12), pages: 1158-1162, 1992) which stated that the LD50 for Naja oxiana was the most toxic/venomous (mice, 0.18 mg/kg SC and lowest reported value was 0.10 mg/kg). Along with that, the mortality rate for untreated Naja oxiana bites are the highest among all Naja species (70-80%). N.oxiana also produced the lowest known lethal dose (LCLo) of 0.005 mg/kg, the lowest among all cobra species ever recorded, derived from an individual case of poisoning by intracerebroventricular injection. Following N. oxiana and N. philippinensis are N. melanoleuca at 0.225 mg/kg SC and then N. samarensis at 0.23 mg/kg. The water cobras (N. annulata and N. christyi also have very toxic venoms, but no SC values are listed. Only intraperitoneal (IP) values of 0.143 mg/kg for N. annulata and 0.12 mg/kg for N. christyi. IP values tend to be generally lower (more toxic than subcutaneous values, so it would be unfair to compare their IP results to the subcutaneous (SC) results of other Naja species. Then I have heard that (without solid evidence) that Naja nivea is the most venomous, although their murine SC LD50 range anywhere from 0.4 mg/kg (Toxicon, Vol. 5, issue 1, page 47, 1967) to 0.72 mg/kg (Australian venoms and toxins Databse). So which is the most venomous? To me it seems obvious that it is the Caspian or Oxus cobra (Naja oxiana), followed by the Philippine cobra (Naja philippinensis). What do you think or know? I've noticed that the Australian venom and toxin Database seems to have higher LD50 values for all snakes across the board. For example, for the black mamba IP value of 0.01 mg/kg is listed (http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/004101018890219X) and Ernst and Zug et al 1996, list a SC value of 0.05 mg/kg for the black mamba. While the Australian venom and toxin Database listed much less toxic LD50's. So there seems to be a lot of variation. 2014-01-23 What's Your Favorite Venomous Snake? 2013-11-13 Deadliest Bite? 2013-09-16 IF the science of self-immunization for a snake envenomation was proven/perfected what is the least benefit(percentage) you would accept before practicing it on yourself? 2013-06-06 how did you learn to keep venomous reptiles? 2013-03-02 View All Survey Questions Have a good idea for a VenomousReptiles.org Survey question? Enter your idea!
Thanks for voting! Your vote has been included in the results below. This question is ONLY for individuals who have been BITTEN by a venomous snake and went to a hospital: "Did you tell the doctors the truth about how you were bitten?"   Posted: Apr 12, 2002   (243 votes, 18 comments) by Charper
Survey Results
Yes 62% (151) No 38% (92)
Survey Comments
To the ignorant person bitten by a Great Basin I was shocked to read that an apparent experienced handler would lose his temper due to his own failings, then kill the snake in fit of anger. The only thing worse was that you equated the consequences to "only losing $50". Your actions demonstrate the exact type of behavior we want to change in people- eliminate the public's 'old testament paranoia' of these magnificent animals. You should be ashamed. Posted by Earth on July 29, 2002 Told the Truth After 22 years of handling all types of snakes, venomous and nonvenomous, I was nicked by my Timber Rattler while trying to rush through feeding. My first thought was "survive". I did everything right, and the paramedics were at my house within 6 minutes, along with everybody with a scanner wondering who got bit by a snake in January. After 4 days in the hospital and a $12,000 bill, the general thought with my friends was "oh, he had an accident-I knew that would happen". A month later, a Southern Copperhead bit me. I can't describe the negative feelings I had on that one. "He's done it again-what an idiot". Even though it was only a Copperhead, it was a much harder event to get over for me. My attitude was real bad (how could this happen again?), it was a full "I-hate-your-mother" bite, and it also brought the medical total up to $17,386. I can't imagine not telling the truth, but it was a real drag to do so, especially the second time. I lost all my confidence for two years and got rid of all 45 snakes I had. I am grateful to God that I still have all my fingers, and I'm starting to get the desire back. I would like to say 'thanks' to you folks and all the others who have created such great websites in the last two years. God bless. Posted by Keith on July 10, 2002 Amen You KILLED the snake that bit you?? While my foot was hurting and swelling I moved the pygmy that got me to a safer location - not for me but for her/him. A big Indigo lives under my boat and I was afraid the little rattler would be a menu item. If all these animals are to you is "fifty bucks" why do you bother? LZ Posted by LadyZane on May 4, 2002 To the jerk who killed the snake that bit him No sympathy. None whatsoever. You took this snake into captivity, put it in a box, handled it and frightened it, and it bit you in self defense. The snake did not ask to be there. It did not ask you to please take it into captivity and handle it. YOU made those choices. You are bigger than the snake. You are responsible for having frightened and harrassed it into biting you. So because you screwed up, you decided to punish an animal that was only defending itself against a much bigger, scarier, more dangerous and aggressive creature - ie, YOU. Utterly disgusted, TT Posted by MSTT on May 4, 2002 To the jerk who killed the snake that bit him No sympathy. None whatsoever. You took this snake into captivity, put it in a box, handled it and frightened it, and it bit you in self defense. The snake did not ask to be there. It did not ask you to please take it into captivity and handle it. YOU made those choices. You are bigger than the snake. You are responsible for having frightened and harrassed it into biting you. So because you screwed up, you decided to punish an animal that was only defending itself against a much bigger, scarier, more dangerous and aggressive creature - ie, YOU. Utterly disgusted, TT Posted by MSTT on May 3, 2002 Older white female No it's not just the young guys who get tagged. I'm 51 in Central Florida with a farm next to a Nature Conservancy preserve. I go herping every other weekend. But it was when I was barefoot in my barnyard that I failed to see the little pygmy rattler. I waited until the next day to go to my doctor. It wasn't a dry bite, but the swelling and discomfort weren't serious. I only required a lecture and an antibiotic. There was just no way to convince him it was truly accidental since he knew I had just tried to rehab an injured "pig". At least I didn't step on the big Eastern that stalks my henhouse from time to time. LZ Posted by LadyZane on May 2, 2002 Don't doubt it!!! Heh heh! What most people don't realize, is how many hits this site gets. For the month of April our raw hits are well over 1,100,000. So the fact that 163 people that visit this site have been bitten doesn't surprise me. The key demographic for this site directly mirrors the statistics for people who are bitten most - white males between the ages of 16 and 36. And there are 80,000 bites per decade in the US. So, it's really not hard for me to believe that some of our visitors are among them. Chris Harper webmaster Posted by Charper on May 1, 2002 My loss I was bit by a Great Basin while moving it to a transfer box. I had just sold a pair and split glance in the other direction and was all it wrote. I not only lost my temper and killed the snake (out $50), when I told the doctor what had happened he laughed at me. $36,000 later... my lesson is over and I am much more careful. I broke no laws so why LIE? Snakebyte Posted by snakebyte01 on April 27, 2002 I voted.... I found it hard to believe that there were 150 or so people who have actually been bitten and who actually visit this site. I had no comment to make about the survey itself, but since AnonEmouse decided to speak up, I figured I'd open my mouth and remove any doubt as to whether I'm a fool or not. I was bitten by N. naja about 15 months ago, and I told the medical staff everything. I was in violation of no law(s), so I didn't have anything to hide, and the life I saved was my own. Tom Townsend Posted by TomT on April 27, 2002 Foul Flag on the Play!!! I am sorry for the disturbance but I am just not willing to believe that there are 140 venomous snakebite survivors taking this survey and only 8 of them had any comment at all. It is a shame that you all can't ensure that the parameters you have set for a survey are followed by the participants. To those who provided comment, thanks for your candor and sharing. Roaring from atop a tilting wheel of Edam, The Mouse In The House (Didn't vote, never been caught!) Posted by AnonEMouse on April 24, 2002 Jurliki Hey, men, never take in hand a hungry Naja (is an experience i had), and NEVER if you were playin' before with your son's hamster. Byez Posted by Jurliki on April 24, 2002 Snake bit in Wyoming in January... by a Rhino viper. Truth was all I had. Who'd have guessed they'd have a Doc that was well versed in treating envenomation. Whole experience was unique to say the least. Posted by DKT on April 24, 2002 It didn't feel right, I shouldn't have done it One evenin, when I was 16, I ran across (see almost ran over)a broad banded copperhead. I was very excited and armed only with a baseball glove to pin his head, I decided to "head" him. I got a nice tap on the thumb for my trouble. I tailed him with the help of a stick and went on to the house. My Dad loaded me up and took me to the hospitol where, after a couple of hours, they decided to do nothing and sent me home. I will always remember the look of disgust on the nurse's face as she said "you guys and snakes" She shook her whole body, like someone had dropped ice down the back of her green OR scrubs. Once home, my mother worked up a fine herbal tea steeped from some locally found mint like plant that cleared up my nausea and aching like magic. My arm swoll up to my chest and I missed one day of school. Naturally, when I returned, the rumor was I had died. :p I think I shall avoid getting "tapped" again. Posted by theMAC on April 23, 2002 Hello fellow bite victoms! I got as stupid as one could get on a Saturday morning. I was trying to force feed a Copperhead a gold fish, which is very slippery and slid out of my hand while my finger slid sraight into his mouth.There was no way I was going to tell the doctor that story. Jeff Quarles Lyn VA Posted by cottonmouth on April 20, 2002 The truth... When I was stupid enough to manage to get bitten by a caged snake while driving down the road, I figured it was only fair to the hospital that they really know what happened. I gave them some background on what I do and let them know that I wasn't completely dumb to what snakebite is about and said that it isn't that pressing, I just wanted bloodwork and a check to make sure everything would be alright... I then called my major professor and asked him to come up and see what he thought of the situation and called my brother and told him to inform the family of the situation and to tell everyone that I'm alright but to keep quiet about it and that I didn't need any drama around the snake bite. Everything went well and I was surprised that the doctors knew as much as they did about snakebite from local snakes, even though they did say it was the first cottonmouth bite they'd seen. I ended up only having to take some antibiotics to ensure infection wouldn't set in. I didn't take any pain killers (the nurse looked at me VERY oddly when I told her that I wanted to know what it was like so I could write it in my notes, and then requested a pen and paper instead of pain killers). Posted by bobby_neal on April 13, 2002 i lied mom diddnt When i was 15 or 16 i was bitten twice by a very large northern copperhead either in or near a vein. I told the staff that i had been pulling weeds. Mom came in and told them the truth. I doubt they believed me anyway it was march and cold. No permanent damage and after 3 pointless hours in the hospital i left. However i then developed a horrible secondary infection of the blood and had to have IV antibiotics for a week. Posted by DougW on April 13, 2002 Bitten Yes,I was cleaning cages and I placed my cottonmouth in with my copperhead as I usually do.On this particular day they didn't like each other and the cottonmouth bit the copperhead on the head and broke off a fang.It was sticking up out of his head,I was hoping to save it by pinning the head and pulling it out,soon as I touched it,she turned her head and barely scraped me.They didn't give me antivenom,but gave me Demerol and I had an allergic reaction to it,so they gave me bynadryl to counter react the demerol.To make it short,it put me in the hospital for 3-4 days on morphine and $4-5000 hospital bill.When I drove myself to the hospital the copperheads head was swollen up huge!I got home and she was perfectly fine needless to say I was missing a tiny piece of my index finger. Posted by BushMstr02 on April 12, 2002 Bitten I told them exactly how I'd gotten whacked: trying to 'head' a large Eastern Diamondback in the field, by hand. Then as I turned out to be sensitive to horse, I wasn't telling anybody much of anything for a while. Lesson learned. f Posted by filthy on April 12, 2002 To post a comment, you must be logged in. If you are not a member, become one now!