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RE: Getting started with Venomous Snakes
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by Dachindae on July 9, 2013
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I really appreciate the people sticking up for me, I really do. Thank you very much. I got put off by the first comment and haven't checked back on this until today.
Just to say, my "snuggling" is not like... hugging or something. I am very gentle with him and I do not force him to sit with me at all times. I only take him out once or twice a week. I bring him out and I allow him to just sit in my lap or on my shoulders or go where he pleases to be more comfortable. His favorite place is on my shoulders between me and the computer chair. When he starts getting too squirmy I put him back into his enclosure. I almost never keep him out for more than an hour at a time. I've had him since I was six years old, I am twenty-one now.
Just because I like to give my snakes nicknames or that I think they are "adorable" does not mean that I am not a responsible owner.
Heck, I have plans to get a female B. g. rhinoceros and name her Cupcake. Gaboon's have the best faces in my opinion. The nose horns are what get me, and just how fat they are.
Reptiles aren't puppies, I get that, but that doesn't mean I can't think they are cute or give them fun names. Getting angry at someone calling a snake cute and calling them out on it is like getting mad at someone who thinks other dangerous animals are cute, such as tigers, lions, bears, etc.
I am very well aware that any hot I interact with can kill, permanently handicap, or land me in the hospital. I am not into hots for the "badass" factor or so that I can brag about the fact that I have dangerous animals. I WANT to work with these animals because they are gorgeous and I find them fascinating. "Snuggling" a hot is a death wish, they are not "pets". They are animals that command respect. They might appreciate that you feed them, but that is it. Their enclosure is their territory and they have the right to try and kill you if you trespass.
I want to do the responsible thing, do my research AND get trained properly. I can watch all the videos I want and I will never be prepared to take on a venomous. I need someone to teach me how to and how not to handle these creatures. I can research and watch all the videos I want, but that is not going to make me the ultimate hot handler. Only experience can prepare me for them.
I understand that I am young and some people are looking down on me for that. But I am making the effort to learn as much as I can about these animals and find someone who will train me before I get my first one.
[I hope I replied to the right thing, goodness. I'm still learning how this site works.]
Again, thank you very much for some of the kind words.
~Kat
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RE: Getting started with Venomous Snakes
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by andrewhopkins on July 10, 2013
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It is great that you want to learn from a mentor. In my state, it is mandatory that you learn from a more experienced person and log 1000 hours. I wish this was mandatory everywhere.
Take no offense, but if you still don't understand why some people reacted the way they did, I am not sure what to tell you. Saying that you like to snuggle your snake or that you like to name them is in extreme poor taste and off-timing when looking to acquire a venomous mentor. Do yourself a favor and don't mention those things next time and you will have a better chance. Don't bother explaining in detail why one has nothing to do with the other, just don't mention it because it is trivial and will only work against you.
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RE: Getting started with Venomous Snakes
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by TheBlackMamba on July 10, 2013
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First of all, what Al Coritz does on YouTube is invaluable to the reptile community. He single handedly demonstrated that a private citizen is more than capable of properly and professionally maintaining a large private collection of dangerous animals. Furthermore, the insights and knowledge that you can gain from watching him work with his animals is priceless. You should be thanking him that he took the time to post all the stuff to YouTube when most people couldn't even be bothered.
Secondly, with regards to the "cuddling" comment your house cat analogy is wrong. Yes, someone who cuddles with a house cat may not cuddle with a lion. However, all snakes do not want t be cuddled. House cats like to cuddle, ball pythons do not. Therefore, I am justified in my concern that she is projecting human (or at least mammalian) emotions onto her animals and that this may cause her to do something irresponsible with her snakes (even if she doesn't cuddle them) that will lead to her getting bit, congress passing new laws, and me losing my collection because of her wreck less actions. I am not trying to be insulting but when learning new things ego's may get stepped on a tad bit.
Third, you are absolutely right that it is not unreasonable to ask for help when learning to work with hot snakes. I was just bracing her for the reality that she may not be able to find someone who will take the time to work with her and that she should start looking into alternative options. I do understand that, "even the best get but" because accidents happen. However, I still maintain my position that keeping hot snakes is simple enough to where you can get by without a mentor as long as you have common sense and are capable of making logical and rational decision and you think about what it is you are going to do before you do it.
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RE: Getting started with Venomous Snakes
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by andrewhopkins on July 10, 2013
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TheBlackMamba, you are making an important second point here. She does seem to be projecting human emotions and that is what worries me, even though she says she understands better. She may not be stupid enough to cuddle with venomous snakes, but she may somehow manage to let her guard down in a given situation from such tendencies. Those things are typically said by keepers who don't have enough experience in taking reptiles seriously. Just like a job interview there are certain things to avoid that might seed doubt when making an impression to ask for a position. I hope you understand this.
Some of the things said here were blunt, but I don't think anyone got angry at you Daechindae. Some people may express themselves freely while others may be more careful. At the end of the day, don't take what was said here too personally. This is not a hobby for those who can't take criticism, those criticisms may end up saving your life.
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RE: Getting started with Venomous Snakes
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by wamartin67 on July 10, 2013
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@BlackMamba- Funny that you're hammering her projecting human qualities then going on about how Al's videos are invaluable. The videos in which he talks to them, names them, and in the case of the black beast, pets them. That's part of what makes his videos great to watch. Some people feel a little connection with their animals and others see them as items in a collection. Also, who's to say her ball python doesn't enjoy sitting on her lap or lying on her shoulders for short periods of time? I doubt it knows a lap, from a shoulder, from a heat rock but the human body is a steady 97.5 degrees and ball pythons aren't the most active snakes in the world so it probably is perfectly content sitting there for a while.
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RE: Getting started with Venomous Snakes
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by TheBlackMamba on July 10, 2013
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@wamartin67 There is a difference between loving and enjoying your animals and believing that they love you. That is the fundamental difference. Whether or not snakes brains are even evolved enough to experience things like joy is the first question. The second is whether they enjoy human contact or whether it stresses them. I am not a vet but I would imagine if it was up to them they would rather be left alone although I do concede that it is in the realm of possibility that they may appreciate some stimulation. This is why I wrote the thread "keeping snakes in the home" in which I specifically argued that the home is a better place for a snake then a zoo because they get more attention and stimulation and aren't treated as just some neglected specimen in a collection that is on display. I enjoy providing quality care for my animals and giving them ideal conditions to live to make them happy. I acknowledge that they may not feel the same way about me but I also understand it is because they are less evolved and do not know any better. Therefore, I provide them with care, which is different from expecting them to provide me with care.
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RE: Getting started with Venomous Snakes
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by greenranger on July 17, 2013
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People come here for help and guidance and then are ridiculed. This hobby is full of arrogant elitist individuals. It doesnt take a rocket scientist to keep venomous snakes, and if you have half a brain chances are you will do just fine. As has been said before on this forum thousands of people buy hot snakes at shows and people arent getting bitten right and left. I wish the normal people who werent interested in trolling the average person would take over and represent the hobby in a way that didnt make an interested newcomer feel like it was a hopeless endeavor. If you like hots and are serious about them, get one. Be careful.
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RE: Getting started with Venomous Snakes
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by Phobos on July 17, 2013
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Greenranger:
1)Start by filling out your profile or be removed.
2)There are some people who deserve to be flamed. This is a fine example:
"Joey xxxxx
I have a question. i recently got a pair of sidewinders and 2 horned lizaerds. can these two live together in a community type setup? the guy i got the sidewinders from said they can but can't find any info to verfy this"
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RE: Getting started with Venomous Snakes
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by greenranger on July 17, 2013
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Do you normally remove people for stating their opinion on the matter? I didnt directly name anyone. I gave an honest response to the discussion in the post.
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