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RE: Suicide by Injection of Rattlesnake Venom
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by pictigaster1 on November 2, 2009
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Jackie if I took you wrong my bad.I have been bit a few times over my life and am a gold card carrying member of the club.Terry I am asking my self this question, there is a bit of research that is not posted there that I have been reading.The truth is if you survive a bite by a deadly snake your may feel that you have basket BALLS.Ego is a hard thing for me to define on another man.I was a non steriod useing body builder I was benching over 400 pounds ,dude my ego was uncageable.So I understand my own that was 5 years ago now I walk with a cain.Life changes ,people change.I must admit some of those phrases do lean no other direction except ego.What I was trying to get out of this thread I have recieved .I do believe that I see your side I see the si side and I see my own side looking in.If this is true voodoo then I am at a loss I have read some good stuff.It reminds me of a politicle or religious discussion .Will this be studied by a true venom lab I do not know will this subject become main stream I do not know.Thanks Terry for takeing your time to read the threads,Thank you Norman for chimeing in and Jackie sorry but you do not know me well enough to question what I do or what this was truely about.You kind of just stepped in at the wrong time sorry.
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RE: Suicide by Injection of Rattlesnake Venom
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by Nakita on November 2, 2009
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Sorry Archie but this is a public forum of which I am a member so I am entitled to add my input.
If you feel like I don't know you well enough then perhaps you should conduct your postings via email where it can be done amongst people who know you better.
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RE: Suicide by Injection of Rattlesnake Venom
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by pictigaster1 on November 2, 2009
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.I talked to exactly who I wanted to and It went well .This is a public forum and you have a right to your opinion.The statements and questions I asked were for them .If you have some imput on si backed by your own knoweldge please chime in.I would love to hear what you know and that is not a lie I would.This is argumentitive and for that I do apologize.If you have had ANA SHOCK PLEASE ELABORATE I have had it, it sucks.I was not trying to argue and please lets keep this civil.You may have something to say that may save a life some day so please Jackie if you have imput I am waiting to read it...Thanks Archie
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RE: Suicide by Injection of Rattlesnake Venom
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by Nakita on November 2, 2009
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Regarding severe allergic reaction,
I have had well over 30 occurrences of Anaphylactic or Anaphylactoid reactions to various stimuli. Sometimes the reaction is easily resolved by Epi and IV antihistamines however on several occassions I have had reoccurrences once the intial symptoms have been resolved. On at least two occassions I have had this cycle repeat 4-5 times within an hour timeframe.
As mentioned earlier I have a disease called Systemic Mastocytosis which causes me to have these extreme reactions to many things. Below is short list of known triggers for me.
Certain antibiotics
Aspirin
Alcohol
Opioid narcotics
Hot peppers
Many spices
Various stinging insects
Stress
Temperature extremes (either hot or cold)
Direct sunlight (UV rays)
Certain perfumes
Some types of dye and food coloring
Friction on my skin
As you can see I have to monitor my environment and carefully micromanage my surroundings to ensure I do not put myself in a position where I am exposed to these things.
The reason I replied to your post was out of concern for a fellow member. As you can see above I know first hand the effects both physically and mentally that these events can have and by your own admission you have experienced it yourself first hand. If you choose to experiment on yourself then you are playing with fire and once again I hope no serious side effects are not encountered.
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RE: Suicide by Injection of Rattlesnake Venom
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by pictigaster1 on November 2, 2009
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I realize that now Jackie hay we all have bad days.The one thing I wont do is let a missunderstanding stop friendship or the love of this hobby
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RE: Suicide by Injection of Rattlesnake Venom
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by stopgetinpopped on November 2, 2009
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Archie, can you share this bit of research you are reading? It doesn't have to be publically. I would never recirculate it etc...but if you or any SI follower knows something that the rest of us dont than it would behoove all involved to share it.
My email is terry@reptilegardens.com
If it's research I'm very interested if its the 'two' regurgitating garbage, I would still read it but in more of a fictional mindset than any actual research.
It's simply not needed, the most offensive thing an SI person ever said was that they were doing it to save countless lives in 3rd world countries....this is a load of crap and don't believe it. SI will not save one life period in a 3rd world country....ever.
Cheers!
T-
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RE: Suicide by Injection of Rattlesnake Venom
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by AquaHerp on November 3, 2009
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Venominme-
I will eagerly await your publications on the subject. We can judge then if it can be filed in the cabinet along with Sherman Minton Jr., B.G. Fry et al, or in the circular file with Raymond Hoser's work.
In the interim, thanks for the advice, if I get time I'll try reading a book. What do you suggest?
Douglas L. Hotle
Curator of Herpetology/Serpentarium
Natural Toxins Research Center
Texas A&M University-Kingsville
www.ntrc.tamuk.edu/
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RE: Suicide by Injection of Rattlesnake Venom
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by venominme on November 3, 2009
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How arrogant to say you don’t know about any of the published studies and then pontificate as if you know what you are talking about (not to any one ion particular). I would encourage any SI’er to post links to support their side, and the anti crowd to do the same.
Do a search for this title:
“Protective Immunity Against á-Cobratoxin Following a Single Administration of a Genetic Vaccine Encoding a Non-Toxic Cobratoxin Variant”
It is an article about using a gene based vaccine and guess what, maybe save a few thousand lives. Since nobody ever reads anything I’ll quote this line “The effectiveness of this approach might serve as a basis to consider the development of a global public health program to protect those at risk for death by snakebite.” It was a worthy effort by the self immunizer to consider using human IgG as the model for the development of a vaccine that didn’t require refrigeration to help save lives in third world areas. What is wrong with that? Why are we under any obligation to educate you? Stop embarrassing yourselves before posting and do some simple searches online and, again, read, read, read. Then come back from a position of knowledge. This is what self immunizers are dealing with. It isn’t really fair to put the burden on the ones who have been doing this for years and years. Even when it is dumbed down to a simple- bite doesn’t damage anymore, look see for yourself- you refuse to accept that either. You don’t accept someone surviving a bite with no antivenom, the most simple basic example of self immunizing at work, and you refuse to read. What are we suppose to do?
Do not feel competent to comment until you read this:
“A Study On The Prophylactic Toxoid Against Venom Of Asian Snakes”
(some one said the conclusion was that it wasn’t very effective- please read it and see if you agree with that)
And this:
“Active Immunization Of A Human Against Naja Naja Venom”
(Army Medical Research Report, maybe not legit enough for you?)
Got links? BRING IT!
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RE: Suicide by Injection of Rattlesnake Venom
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by JHarrison on November 3, 2009
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I prefer to get my medical advise from people like Dr. Warrell, the late Dr. minton and others that have knowledge of the many effects of venom. SI has no effect on tissue damage which is the biggest problem with snakebite worldwide.
I say it again publish in Toxicon or come to a conference.
The future in snakebite treatment is not SI but a better antivenom.
I have a question for SI's what is a lethal dose for man ?LD'50s are based on mice and are just an estimate for humans. Large percentage of snakebites are not even lethal yields for man.
Risk out weighs any benefit. Just use your tools and be careful.
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RE: Suicide by Injection of Rattlesnake Venom
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by JHarrison on November 3, 2009
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Also the papers you give don't back up SI's the french paper talks of DNA/toxiods when SI's use raw venom. The other paper by HH. Flowers is an abstract from 1963. Flowers had many health issues later in life . Also the study was stopped because the risks out weighted the benefits.Show me published papers by any SI's in a peer reviewed journal not an abstract from years ago.
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